Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Galanthus => Topic started by: MarkLyman on February 25, 2017, 03:44:13 PM
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Hi, I've just come across the following next to a clump of 'Modern Art'
Does anyone recognise it please?
Thanks, Mark
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It's clearly either a plicatus or a plicatus hybrid (which would be with nivalis in all probability). But I don't really see any distinguishing features. I have no idea how many named snowdrops might have a similar mark on the inner petals and I'm sure you could find many similar ones in a naturalised plicatus population. Perhaps it's just a seedling?
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Thanks Alan, am tending towards seedling. I've checked other plants I've grown there and nothing like them. Where the leaf emerges from the ground, one side is plicate and the other not.
Really nice to start getting seedlings!
Best, Mark
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I have a small clump of lost label Galanthus - any suggestions?
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Hi John, I'm unable to help - might help others to see the leaves where they exit the ground to at least get the species?
Best, Mark
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Would love if someone could help identify these 2 plants if they already exists. I found them today in a customers garden. Pics 1 to 3 I'm pretty sure is a nivalis and 3 and 4 I'm pretty sure is a plicatus but I could be wrong! Pic 4 shows 2 stems from the same bulb. I was aloud to pot some of them up. Any help would be great! Thanks Shaun.
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Shauney, both of your foundlings have a 'face', which is a type I particularly like. The 'eyes' are very distinct in the first case and rather enlarged in the second. This type of marking is very rare in a pure-bred nivalis, indeed anything other than a smallish mark at the tip of the inner petals would be suspected of being a hybrid. In the first case I cannot see enough of the leaves to take a stab at the species. In the second case I think it might be an elwesii but you need to look closely at the base of the leaves to tell.
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Brian. As I had only just potted them up i u potted them so you can have a better look at the whole plant. This is the first one that I think is nivalis shown in pics 1 to 3 above.
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This is the second one that I think is a plicatus. Shown in pics 4 and 5 from the first pics I posted.
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To be frank, Shauney, I'm still not sure. In both cases the leaves are narrow and appear to be broadly applanate - which would indicate nivalis. But the mark on the inner petals is wrong for nivalis. So I think they are probably hybrids between nivalis and some other species. That species is most likely to be elwesii or plicatus. I cannot spot anything on the photos that indicates which. It is often easier to tell when the leaves are emerging early in the season rather than now. Keep them under observation - and good luck.
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Thank you Brian for having a go. Is there no pure nivalis that have a mark like that then? Thanks Shaun.
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So sorry Alan, I've just noticed I've been calling you Brian! I have no idea why and please accept my apologies. Shaun.
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That's not a problem; both Brian Ellis and I post a good deal here in the Galanthus section of the forum. I am honoured to be confused with Brian but I'm not sure how he would feel about being confused with me!
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Bewildered?
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I've been given this double but the person didn't know it's name,and i was wondering if anyone on here might be able to shed some light! It's been in flower for a week now and still has some to open up,it grows to a hight of about 14 inches,there is some green to the tips of the outer petals and some of the inner petals have a yellow streak down them. Thanks shaun.
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Shaun it looks very much like one of the Greatorex hybrids and very much like 'Lavinia' to me. It is not, however, an exact science. Often people say of the Greatorex hybrids "Answers on a postcard please" as they can vary with maturity of the bulb and therefore resemble each other, but they were the first deliberate crosses so we can't complain. A good place to look (after SRGC of course) is Judy's snowdrops:
http://www.judyssnowdrops.co.uk/Plant_Profiles/Hybrids_Double/lavinia/lavinia.htm (http://www.judyssnowdrops.co.uk/Plant_Profiles/Hybrids_Double/lavinia/lavinia.htm)
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Thanks for the help Brian.
I'm not completely convinced that is it a will have to do more investigation,but its certainly a strong contender and as there is so much confusion over the greatorex doubles I may never really know. So for now I'll question mark it as lavinia.
Thanks again for your help. Shaun.
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Posted this on Galanthus in March section - sorry.
I got a pot of these from a friend today - don't know what they are - can anyone help please?
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Hi, I think that is Galanthus worronowii, best, Mark
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Hi, please could someone help me with trying to identify this? Plant label is unreadable and the customer can't remember it's name and would love to know. Many thanks Shaun.
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Shauney, I don't claim to be able to recognise Galanthus 'Atkinsii' but it's like a nivalis on steroids; taller, more vigorous and flowers earlier. It's also quite readily available so if your photos were taken in the last few days then it's a pretty good bet.
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I don't like hazarding guesses but:
Is the petal length a bit long for Atkinsii? I don’t think I ever got it to 35mm! Atkinsii also threw a high proportion of aberrant flowers with me (that’s why I ended up binning it) These appear to be uniform.
Don’t know where in the country these shots come from, but isn’t it still a bit early for Atkinsii?
Leaves look a bit grey/blue, and its tall…… Is Mrs Macnamara a better fit? The flowers are above the spathe.
Tim DH
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The bad 'Atkinsii' which tends to produce aberrant flowers has been renamed 'James Backhouse'. Supposedly you can get stock which is free from this issue under the original name, 'Atkinsii'. 'Mrs Macnamara' is classed as an elwesii. The leaves are not particularly broad but I think they are obviously supervolute whereas 'Atkinsii' has applanate leaves. It's hard to be certain from the photographs but those leaves look applanate to me.
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Thankyou Alan and Tim for your help.I've attached a pic which shows the leaves slightly better and they look supervolute to me. Of the 2 names given so far... I'd have to say it looks more like Mrs Macnamara. Thanks Shaun.
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Forgot to add that the pics were taken today in north Hampshire and even though it was only 5° and drizzling some of the flowers were open.
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Does this help?
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The trouble with lost label snowdrops is that many are not sufficiently distinct to be identified again. But in this instance I have come around to Tim's opinion, that Shauney's snowdrop resembles 'Mrs Macnamara' in most aspects including flowering time, assuming this is repeated year-on-year.
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Hello,
Can you please help me identify this galanthus.
Thank you very much.
Marie-Rose
[attach=1]
[attach=2]
[attach=3]
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Marie-Rose, Your snowdrop has elwesii-like leaves, strong green tips on the outer petals, an x-shaped mark on the inner petals and a very messy interior arrangement of the inner petals (including repeats of the outer petals). I cannot think of any cultivar like this. Is it flowering now? Are you certain you acquired it as a named variety?
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hello,
Thank you Alan_b for your answer,
He's been blooming for a week in the garden.
I think of Galanthus elwesii 'Rosie' but I'm not sure.
Marie-Rose from France
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I think 'Rosie' is a good stab at the correct identification. That's not one I grow myself or remember seeing but Ruben posted a picture here http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12602.msg321648#msg321648 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12602.msg321648#msg321648) which looks quite similar and he notes that it is early flowering.
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I grow 'Rosie', in honour of my daughter of the same name ;), and agree that it's a good match to your photos Marie-Rose.
However, as Alan says, it's often hard to identify a 'lost label' galanthus cultivar with any certainty due to proliferation of named forms that look rather similar.
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I agree with Ashley that you should be very wary identifying a 'lost label' snowdrop because many are too similar for this to be possible. Now if you knew for certain that you had owned 'Rosie' but could not find it growing anywhere with a label then that would be more evidence in favour of the provisional identification. When I plant a new snowdrop I try to take a picture of the snowdrop and the label in close-up, then another from a distance with the snowdrop in the centre of the frame to show where it is in the garden.
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Many thanks Alan-b and ashley for your interest of identification my Galanthus Rosie.
It's the right snowdrop.
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Thank you Alan_b. You gave me a good solution. This is how I'm going to do for my 25 snowdrops spots in the garden.
[attach=1]
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That's very nicely done, Marie-Rose. What software did you use for your numbers and captions?
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Photoshop + Excel
I use Photoshop for the photo and the numbers and I make a copy/paste from Excel of the texts.
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In my garden I have a small group of Galanthus elwesii which I bought under this name from our local garden shop that is merely a farmer providing place. I'd like to know if they have a more specific addition to the name. They're flowering since more than 3 weeks but today they opened completely for the first time.
[attach=1][attach=2]
Then I have another one which I brought from an exchange market. It is labelled "galathus nivalis ssp imparati". I cannot find this in any book or on the internet. The flower is not yet open, so it's no use to photograph it now. Does anybody know this cultivar?
Regards
Hannelore
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.... It is labelled "galathus nivalis ssp imparati". I cannot find this in any book or on the internet. The flower is not yet open, so it's no use to photograph it now. Does anybody know this cultivar?
Presumably G. nivalis subsp. imperati (see e.g. here (http://encyclopaedia.alpinegardensociety.net/plants/Galanthus/imperati)). G. imperati is considered a synonym of G. nivalis.
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Presumably G. nivalis subsp. imperati (see e.g. here (http://encyclopaedia.alpinegardensociety.net/plants/Galanthus/imperati)). G. imperati is considered a synonym of G. nivalis.
Thank you. I'll post a photo as soon as it's open.
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Galanthus elwesii .... I'd like to know if they have a more specific addition to the name.
The inner petals have two marks, one towards the tip and one towards the base. So they are Galanthus elwesii var. elwesii.
It is labelled "galathus nivalis ssp imparati".
Imperati is a name that was applied to a particularly large form of Galanthus nivalis. Supposedly this form is found in regions of Italy, as Ashley's reference states. These days we are not so impressed by mere size so I think this usage is passing into history.
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I have got a Email of a gardenfriend, she wants to know the name of the snowdrop of the foto. I can see, it is a G.elwesii and guess the variety as: Alanya Yayla with a similar form of the green markers. Can You help me to identify this snowdrop?
Thanks Harald Alex
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The Galanthus elwesii that you can buy in garden centres or find established in gardens show a huge range of different marks on the inner petals. As a result it isn't generally possible to identify an example of Galanthus elwesii just on this basis. I agree that it looks like a snowdrop circulated with the name 'from Alanya Yayla' or similar but how can you be sure that it is that snowdrop and not just one that looks similar? Perhaps if you could do a side-by-side comparison and look at every aspect: flowers leaves, size, flowering time, scent then you might know but I don't think it is going to be possible to tell just from photographs.
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The Galanthus elwesii that you can buy in garden centres or find established in gardens show a huge range of different marks on the inner petals. As a result it isn't generally possible to identify an example of Galanthus elwesii just on this basis. I agree that it looks like a snowdrop circulated with the name 'from Alanya Yayla' or similar but how can you be sure that it is that snowdrop and not just one that looks similar? Perhaps if you could do a side-by-side comparison and look at every aspect: flowers leaves, size, flowering time, scent then you might know but I don't think it is going to be possible to tell just from photographs.
thank You Alan nery much for Your informations. I had a compare with pictures from Günter Waldorfs book "Schneeglöckchen Zauber in Weiß" where he wrote, that such snowdrops especially in germany are grown. The gardenfreind got thes under the name "Carmen" from her auntie, but such a variety I dont know! Greetings Harald
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If it's called 'Carmen' then that is what it is. If it ever had another name, why would it have been changed? Anyone can give a name to a snowdrop (provided that name has not been used already for another snowdrop). I looked online and can find no reference to a snowdrop named 'Carmen', either yours or any other. So the name may well be available for use.
You can, if you wish, apply to register the name with the KAVB, the registration authority for snowdrops. I myself have registered a double snowdrop called 'Cressida' and a vigorous inversely poculiform snowdrop called 'The More the Merrier'. I believe Anne Wright ('Annew') registered her Dryad Gold series names.
However, these days a snowdrop needs to be quite special to merit being named. 'Carmen' is pretty enough but the marks on the inner petals are not out of the ordinary; you found another one that looks quite similar and that is named for the place where it was found as much as for anything else. But perhaps 'Carmen' has other qualities that are not visual? There's one called 'Cedric's Prolific' that was named (some while ago) for being prolific.
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If it's called 'Carmen' then that is what it is. If it ever had another name, why would it have been changed? Anyone can give a name to a snowdrop (provided that name has not been used already for another snowdrop). I looked online and can find no reference to a snowdrop named 'Carmen', either yours or any other. So the name may well be available for use.
You can, if you wish, apply to register the name with the KAVB, the registration authority for snowdrops. I myself have registered a double snowdrop called 'Cressida' and a vigorous inversely poculiform snowdrop called 'The More the Merrier'. I believe Anne Wright ('Annew') registered her Dryad Gold series names.
However, these days a snowdrop needs to be quite special to merit being named. 'Carmen' is pretty enough but the marks on the inner petals are not out of the ordinary; you found another one that looks quite similar and that is named for the place where it was found as much as for anything else. But perhaps 'Carmen' has other qualities that are not visual? There's one called 'Cedric's Prolific' that was named (some while ago) for being prolific.
Thank You Alan for the interesting informations, especially to the procedur of registration of snowdrop-names.
I will inform the gardenfriend with the snowdrop foto! In my garden dayly more snowdrops open their flowers!
Greeting and a fine weekend wish You Harald Alex
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I was at a car boot today and found someone selling snowdrops among other plants. I selected these as they were different. This was labelled as a woronowii but the leaves on this one are different to the one I grow. Is this normal or is mine wrongly labled? In the first and second pictures the plant on the left is my plant and the right is the one I bought today. As you can see the leaf shape is different in shape and colour. The right one is more rounded and less glossy Many thanks Shaun.
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They are G. woronowii.
johnw
7c & drizzle
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The second plant I got was s scharlockii but most have only one developed ear. I've never seen it on mine before again is this a normal thing? Many thanks Shaun.
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Any ideas if this is a named variety? Many thanks Shaun
[attachimg=1]
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Quite nice whatever it is
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Hi, a customer was given this a couple of years ago but has lost the label and can't remember who gave it to them either. I've tried to look myself but can't pin it down so was hoping someone here may be able to shed some light. Many thanks Shaun.
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The second plant I got was s scharlockii but most have only one developed ear. I've never seen it on mine before again is this a normal thing? Many thanks Shaun.
Normally in this type the spathe is very large and intact or very large and split into to 'ears' of equal length. I have never seen a long and short ear as your photo seems to show.
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Hi, a customer was given this a couple of years ago but has lost the label and can't remember who gave it to them either. I've tried to look myself but can't pin it down so was hoping someone here may be able to shed some light. Many thanks Shaun.
Well the mark on the inner petals is what you might find in plicatus subs. byzantinus ("The Istanbul Snowdrop"). But the leaves are quite narrow and I cannot see any folding back so perhaps it is a plicatus x nivalis hybrid? To be honest, a snowdrop like this would not be named on looks alone these days; although it might have other virtues. I'm sure at a place like Myddleton House you could easily find half a dozen different ones that look similar.
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Normally in this type the spathe is very large and intact or very large and split into to 'ears' of equal length. I have never seen a long and short ear as your photo seems to show.
Of whats flowering... I'd say about 90% were like that. 5% had one that was about half the length of the other and the rest were normal. It's a very congested 2lt pot so will divide when dorment.
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Well the mark on the inner petals is what you might find in plicatus subs. byzantinus ("The Istanbul Snowdrop"). But the leaves are quite narrow and I cannot see any folding back so perhaps it is a plicatus x nivalis hybrid? To be honest, a snowdrop like this would not be named on looks alone these days; although it might have other virtues. I'm sure at a place like Myddleton House you could easily find half a dozen different ones that look similar.
Thanks for having a go Alan.
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Any ideas if this is a named variety? Many thanks Shaun
´Gloucester Old Spot´looks similar.
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´Gloucester Old Spot´looks similar.
As do any number of snowdrops you can find in a naturalised nivalis population. 'Gloucester Old Spot' is a great name but it's one of those snowdrops that was the first of its type to be found and named. With hindsight it is far from unique.
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´Gloucester Old Spot´looks similar.
Thanks Mariette. It looks similar but it's not that in my eyes. Colour is different and yours looked a bit floppy where as mine is very upright staying up in wet and windy weather and even after the -3 frost we just had it stayed upright when others I have flopped.
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As do any number of snowdrops you can find in a naturalised nivalis population. 'Gloucester Old Spot' is a great name but it's one of those snowdrops that was the first of its type to be found and named. With hindsight it is far from unique.
I'll still enjoy it name or no name. Many thanks Shaun.
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As do any number of snowdrops you can find in a naturalised nivalis population. 'Gloucester Old Spot' is a great name but it's one of those snowdrops that was the first of its type to be found and named. With hindsight it is far from unique.
As I´ve got a soft spot for snowdrops with such dainty marks, I collected some myself and learned, that ´Gloucester Old Spot´has been superseded by other varieties. Are there any recommendations for superiour varieties?
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Anyone have any ideas what this might be? The lable says caucasicus but i cant find many pictures of the flowers online and nothing that matched mine.. Also I might be wrong but is this name not used anymore and now called alpinus? The outers are 32mm long. Many thanks Shaun.
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Caucasicus is the old name for elwesii var. monostictus, I believe. That's what it looks like.
Have a look at this one, http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=16074.0 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=16074.0) . 'Trumpington' is the same type and a similar size but with green marks on the outers.
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Cheers for that Alan.
Shaun.
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The second plant I got was s scharlockii but most have only one developed ear. I've never seen it on mine before again is this a normal thing? Many thanks Shaun.
Hallo Shauney, in my collection I have two parts of "Viridapice" snowdrops from different sources, one with dobble "ears" and one with only one big ear.
It is right to say, the first is "Scharlockii" and the second is "Viridapiece" ?
Foto 1: G. viridapice with two long "Ears"
Foto 2: G. viridapice with one long "Ear"
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Given the opportunity, I like to point out that 2018 is the 150th anniversary of Galanthus 'Scharlockii'. 'Warei' turned-up about 20 years later and 'Viridapice' later still. 'Scharlockii' was probably an ancestor to the two later forms. Since they were discovered they have been setting seed and cross-breeding so what we have now is a wealth of different clones with similar characteristics. The 'ear' is a very elongated spathe and you get two 'ears' when this splits into two halves. Therefore if you have two 'ears' you would expect them to be the same length and this is normally what you see. Shauney will have to do some close observation next year to work out how two ears of unequal length come about.
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Shauney will have to do some close observation next year to work out how two ears of unequal length come about.
Alan, As I mentioned before the clump does need splitting which I will do just as they start going dorment. There are three distinct types, those with normal, those with one normal and one about half the length and then those with one normal and one just a few millimetres long. All the bulbs that are flowering have been tagged. They will be potted up into those groups to see what happens next year. That's all I can do for now and I'll report back on my findings next year. Shaun.
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I found yesterday in my snowdropgarden between many G nivalis one flowersprout, that looks strange! I didnt see till now and need your help! Will this be a Scharlockii - Type? Thank You!
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Two snowdrops. Thought they were the same, but not sure now. One is labelled Wendy’s Gold, the other Spindlestone Surprise.
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[attachimg=2]
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... One is labelled Wendy’s Gold, the other Spindlestone Surprise.
'Wendy's Gold' has a much fuller mark on the inner petals that 'Spindlestone Surprise'. The first picture is not 'Wendy's Gold', the second picture easily could be.
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Is there anything I can do to make my uploads come in upright instead of sideways?
Hi Chris,
All the pictures I've uploaded on here have been taken with and sent from my mobile, I've had some end up the wrong way and have pinpointed this down to being wether they were taken in portrait or landscape. The pics I upload that were taken in portrait are always on there side so I try and always remember now to take in landscape, and sofar they have always been up the correct way. I don't know why this should be but this is my observations. Hope this helps.
Shaun.
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Thanks so much, and yes, the first pic is Spindlestone Surprise. The other is Wendy’s Gold, or at least that’s what the label said.
Shauney, I will try to remember to take them that way now. Thanks
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Is there anything I can do to make my uploads come in upright instead of sideways?
If photos are taken "sideways" by a camera phone or i-pad and then rotated by you before you post them, it seems that the original format is "remembered" when it is loaded to the forum and appears sideways. It seems that I can usually override that when I rotate them here. :)
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Will this be a Scharlockii - Type?
It seems likely but wait patiently for a few days and you will find out.
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Hello all,
I have been visiting this forum for a while already. Being rather inexperienced with most plants, I think I'd rather sit back and learn instead of sharing an unsubstanciated opinion. So far.
I am not in danger of becoming a Galanthomaniac, I believe, but this forum has raised my interest in this genus and am starting to grow a couple of bulbs, mostly from seed.
I also bought two bulbs of Galanthus transcaucasicus ex Nagorny Karabach last autumn.
Plants grown from seed from the same source have been shown here and there identity has been questioned. My Galanthus clearly has applanate leaves which does not fit with the description for transcaucasicus.
From Tom Mitchells blog (Revolution Snowdrops) I'm getting the idea that these plants may in fact be G. lagodechianus since they look pretty much like those photographed in Armenia. Leaves fit the description and they are 8-10 mm wide.
Any comment much appreciated.
Thanks,
Carsten
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And I thank you once again, Miss Maggi, xxx
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Bless you, Christine - it's my pleasure.
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I also bought two bulbs of Galanthus transcaucasicus ex Nagorny Karabach last autumn.
Plants grown from seed from the same source have been shown here and there identity has been questioned. My Galanthus clearly has applanate leaves which does not fit with the description for transcaucasicus.
You have leaves that are applanate with a distinct median stripe. They are green rather than glaucous and stand erect. The flower in your first picture looks quite similar to that of a nivalis, the flower in the last picture less so. I would not disagree with your identification as G. lagodechianus but I know little about this species; it is rarely grown in gardens here.
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Many thanks for your assessment, Alan!
I'm trying to read more about these species: the current red data book of Armenia does not list G. transcaucasicus for the country anymore but calls the plants found in the SE corner of the country G. artjuschenkoae. A population of G. lagodechianus/artjuschenkoae in Nagorny Karabach would fill a gap in the distribution map.
I'm getting the impression that the identification of this snowdrop as G. transcaucasicus was based on an old textbook.
I should point out that the quality of the bulbs I received from this vendor was flawless and the one Narcissus flowering for me fits the current classification.
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It seems likely but wait patiently for a few days and you will find out.
Hallo Alan, the strange nivalis starts to open the flower and shows green markers in the outher flowerleaves. I think, this is a next indiz for "Scharlockii !?
Greetings from germany, where the weather prognose says: next week nightfrosts till -20 °C and no snow! :-(
from Harald Alex
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Hello!
These bulbs have been on this spot more then 20 years and now there are beginning to show some yellow ones. What specie could this be?
Edit by maggi : Sorry, the links no longer work to the outside server from where ptallbo shared his images. :'(
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Difficult to say but, apart from the inner segment mark, they have a look of Galanthus gracilis about them. Perhaps a gracilis hybrid? They seem quite robust.
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There have been no other specie in their surroundings, niether at the neighoburs either, and I do think that it should be a pure specie, or at least the bulbs are bought at that once... And it is a small and robust plant. About 10-15cm high with the leafs and the yellowish ones are smaller or more robust, they reach 10cm. I will get new pictures when spring arrives again. Now they are covered with +100cm of snow... :)
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Hej, ptallbo, we´re often on holiday in Sweden, but hardly ever saw anything else but G. nivalis and occasionally elwesii growing in gardens or churchyards. It would be interesting to find G. gracilis in a garden so high up in the North. Do You have an idea whether someone with botanical interest planted these snowdrops? To determine the species it would be helpful to show whether the leaves are applanate or supervolute. Anyway, the yellow coloration is a tempting feature. The fact that the yellowish ones are smaller may be due to inbreeding, which favours the development of yellowish coloration.
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Ptallbo, I think what you have is Galanthus graecus. This looks like a hybrid between elwesii and gracilis so not everyone accepts that it is genuinely a separate species. I have seen it sold as elwesii in my local garden centre. Graecus has the broad leaves of elwesii with the twist of gracilis.
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Thank you!!
I have planted them myself..:) But trying to remeber what when a snowdrop was a snowdrop and no care about specie or name.. is hard .:)
I will make better pictures this spring when they emerge, or when the snow has melted, and that will take a while to get that 100cm away. I will help out and reomove some as well..:)
About the yellowish I assume there are few specie of crossing ot specie that makes yellow...?
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Of most species yellow selections are known, though they are comparatively rare. There are also hybrids with yellow ovary and/or marks.
Galanthus gracilis often shows a very light coloured ovary, so this is a point for David´s and Alan´s assumption.
Anyway, it´s a very attractive snowdrop You grow!
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hi -- first time uploading a picture so please bear with me, these are also terrible bad smart phone pictures and im also im fairly new to snowdrop madness.
I came across this today in a very old church grave yard. In the middle of an established clump of G. Nivallis and about 16 inches from several established clumps of Galanthus nivalis flore pleno.
Its small but looks very much like a yellow double but with the yellow ovary -- Im only aware of Galanthus nivalis flore pleno Lady Elphinstone -- but doesnt that have a green ovary ?
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having trouble with pictures sorry
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this is without flash or filters -- my smart phone is bad -- in fact it was run over by a car last week -- but still going
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this is without flash or filters -- my smart phone is bad -- in fact it was run over by a car last week -- but still going
Looks really cool, any chance you could get to grow it yourself? I'm no expert, but as a far as I know lady elphinstone indeed has green ovaries.
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Im only aware of Galanthus nivalis flore pleno Lady Elphinstone -- but doesnt that have a green ovary ?
There are one or two other double yellow nivalis snowdrops but it isn't completely certain that these are not 'Lady Elphinstone' rediscovered. I think you are right that 'Lady Elphinstone' has a green ovary (receptacle) so what you have found may be completely new, not a known cultivar. However snowdrops that have emerged in the dark, trapped under leaves perhaps, may appear temporarily yellow but will green-up in a week or two when exposed to light.
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Thanks for that info Alan.
I think this drop would have been above soil for several weeks but will go back and look next week.
As a side note -- whats the general way of getting hold of a snowdrop thats growing in a church yard ? Im not aware of who owns them or who to approach -- warden etc
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I have done this a few times by seeking permission from the churchwarden. I have always explained that I only want to remove a few bulbs and have never yet been refused.
Modified to correct typo
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Here they are in their full glory, which specie this could be, it is these that I have had here many years and bought as specie so no hybrid and no other snowdrops in the surroundings either unitl last season when I planted several species in the same bed.
Edit by maggi - sorry , it seems the links to these images are no longer valid.
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What you have appears to be a self-seeding colony. The leaves seem less twisted than I thought, although it is there to a degree. I still think the yellowing on some drops could be the result of being starved of light some time earlier. You may need to wait until next year to be sure, one way or the other.
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Thank you! Yes I have planted some bulbs once and from that the whole colony have emerged ..:) They have been covered with snow this spring until I removed it, so it is possible that they are lack of light but they have got sunlight for several weeks now and still are yellow and some were yellow last year as well with no cover of snow. These are not as affected as many of my other are, they were fully grown when I removed the snow so they were yellow due to lack of light so now I know that I need to remove the snow from this bed due to early growers.
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Hi, please could someone help me with trying to identify this?
(https://i.imgur.com/rPXe2At.jpg)
Unnamed#006
(https://i.imgur.com/gMlM60l.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/vcBP4tq.jpg)
Unnamed#010
(https://i.imgur.com/TqWh9i2.jpg)
Unnamed#009
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I wonder if the experts amongst us might be able to help me ID this one please. My label says elwesii but I just have the memory (these days memories are somewhat tenuous!) that when I got it the label possibly said caucasicus. I've been reading Freda Cox's book and I'm utterly confused now between elwesii, elwesii var. monostictus, and caucasicus (syn alpinus). Hope the pictures are good enough.
[attachimg=1]
[attachimg=2]
[attachimg=3]
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Hi David -- looks a lot like a Galanthus Woronowii to me but i get just as confused about that group - with its woodland type such as possibly this and its rock type with the completely different leaf form, and then of course Galanthus ikariae which it was distributed as for many years.
So a definately non expert opinion is its Woronowii ? ;)
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QUOTE :
For a long time, the name elwesii was reserved for plants with both an apical and a basal green mark on the inner petal. Plants with only a single apical mark were thought to be a separate species, Galanthus caucasicus. A better understanding of these plants in the wild shows that they are both variants of a highly variable species and the name elwesii has priority. The single marked plants ("caucasicus of gardens") are correctly known as elwesii var. monostictus. Although the single marked plants are very rare in the wild, they are very common in gardens; a phenomenon that remains to be fully explained.
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Hello David, I think it is Galanthus woronowii. Here's my picture from my garden
(https://i.imgur.com/MLBIGXd.jpg)
Galanthus woronowii
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Thank for responding deee and Stefan and thanks very much for your help. I've very much had a Snowdrop query day to day because in addition I took some pictures this afternoon of a plant I received a couple of years ago labelled as Galanthus ikariae and tried to see it in the light of another plant I've always thought of as woronowii. I think you are right and I now have three clumps of woronowii.
The plant I got as ikariae is posted below but the flower is pretty much past it's best.
[attachimg=1]
[attachimg=2]
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I think your first plant might be ikariae - it shows the little blisters on the leaf surface which correspond to the large air spaces inside the leaves. Not an expert on these two though - I have a whole Word document with bits taken from the forum at different times where experienced growers have tried to help us out.
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Anne would you be able to post that word document either here or in woronowii variations etc ?
Im finding that bulk buying dormant Woronowii a very cost effective and interesting process with considerable variation and so far the best i can do is just identify possible woodland variation against mountian/rock variety. Any extra information be very helpfull.
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Thanks Anne for confusing me further ;D
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Inner marks seems a bit small for ikariae and lots of woronowii are sell under the name ikariae but I'm really not a specialist. In fact, that's why I'm posting here ;D
I took back from my parent's home these snowdrops with some bulbs of elwesii. I remember buying the elwesii but no other snowdrop and my mum have some nivalis in the garden.
They are shorter than elwesii (which grow 20 cm from this clump) and the two marks of the inner petal are well separated, so, I wonder if it could be a hybrid between elwesii and nivalis. My elwesii seems to be self-sterile since they have made no seeds for at least 3 years.
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David's second snowdrop (labelled as ikariae) is without doubt woronowii. Note that the mark on the inner segments is a very flat-topped bridge; the flat top is typical of woronowii and not much seen otherwise. I am less certain about the first one but would concur with Anne's reasoning for identifying it as ikariae.
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I cannot see anything in Karaba's snowdrops to make me doubt that they are pure elwesii. Elwesii cover a large range of sizes, from quite small to very large indeed. They generally set seed quite readily so in a large "swarm" you will see a range of sizes and markings. I think I also see a small green mark at the tip of the outer segments.
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Thanks Alan .
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Anne would you be able to post that word document either here or in woronowii variations etc ?
Im finding that bulk buying dormant Woronowii a very cost effective and interesting process with considerable variation and so far the best i can do is just identify possible woodland variation against mountian/rock variety. Any extra information be very helpfull.
Unfortunately I can't find a way to make it under 200KB so I can't post it.
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Anne would you be able to post that word document either here or in woronowii variations etc ?
The search facility of the forum is pretty efficient, deee, if you'd like to make your own researches.
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Anne W. has very kindly provided her compilation of notes of galanthus woronowii / ikariae identification - see the link below to download a pdf :
http://files.srgc.net/general/Woronowii-ikariae-identification-notes-ex-forum.pdf (http://files.srgc.net/general/Woronowii-ikariae-identification-notes-ex-forum.pdf)
Thank you, Anne!
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Anne - thankyou very much for that -- much appreciated !!
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Really helpfull read -- thankyou --
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I cannot see anything in Karaba's snowdrops to make me doubt that they are pure elwesii. Elwesii cover a large range of sizes, from quite small to very large indeed. They generally set seed quite readily so in a large "swarm" you will see a range of sizes and markings. I think I also see a small green mark at the tip of the outer segments.
Thanks Alan. Yes there's a small green mark on outer segment but the nivalis from my mother's garden have some very small also.
I was a bit surprise because my original elwesii, the one I bought, is tall, with very wide leaves and a big inner mark. It is on the right on the picture below and it hasn't set seeds for the last 3 years (since I bring it back at home) . It staid ~20 years at my parent's home but didn't make a big clump and I wasn't there to see if it made seeds or not...
I have now 2 questions (for my curiosity only) that I know the answer will be difficult :
- can a elwesii, tall and with a big green mark on inner petal give by selfseeding a small elwesii with 2 very distant small green marks ?
- how would be an hybrid between nivalis and elwesii ? Is there a caracteristic to differentiate this kind of hybrid with a 'pure' elwesii ?
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I have now 2 questions (for my curiosity only) that I know the answer will be difficult :
- can a elwesii, tall and with a big green mark on inner petal give by selfseeding a small elwesii with 2 very distant small green marks ?
- how would be an hybrid between nivalis and elwesii ? Is there a caracteristic to differentiate this kind of hybrid with a 'pure' elwesii ?
To answer the second question first, snowdrops thought to be nivalis/elwesii hybrids may have narrower leaves than the typical elwesii and these leaves may not be so clearly supervolute. But they still look much more like elwesii than nivalis. And nobody knows if snowdrops of this type really are hybrids or just look as if they might be.
I cannot directly answer the first question but here are some observations:
- There isn't much else in flower when snowdrops are in flower and it would not surprise me if the bees, when active, cover quite a wide area when collecting nectar and spreading pollen.
- If a snowdrop sets seed you can never know if it has self-seeded, been pollinated by some nearby snowdrop or by another one from some distance away.
- If you look through a large colony of elwesii in cultivation (which admittedly are not common) you will often see a range of sizes and marks, both single and double.
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Thank you Alan for all these details
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Does anyone know what this Snowdrop is please - I have lost the label and have no earthly idea what it is?
Thanks in anticipation
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Couls someone please explain me the difference between Galanthus scharlockii and Galanthus Warei?
BW
Hannelore
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Couls someone please explain me the difference between Galanthus scharlockii and Galanthus Warei?
BW
Hannelore
I think the spathe on Sharlockii is the longest, always clearly split and markings are more defined than in Warei. They are both nivalis forms and Viridipice can look similar - though Warei has a larger spathe.
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Does anyone know what this Snowdrop is please
You have the leaves trussed-up rather tightly but as far as I can tell it is a form of Galanthus elwesii (var. elwesii). Is it supposed to be a named cultivar?
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I was just wondering, on ebay some one sells "Galanthus warei" (https://www.ebay.de/itm/Schneeglockchen-Galanthus-warei/264204185199?hash=item3d83cbee6f:g:f~UAAOSweTlcaVaE:rk:1:pf:0 (https://www.ebay.de/itm/Schneeglockchen-Galanthus-warei/264204185199?hash=item3d83cbee6f:g:f~UAAOSweTlcaVaE:rk:1:pf:0)) and they seemed to me rather equal to my Galanthus scharlockii.
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Hi Alan - the Snowdrop in question was sold to me as Green Tear - this has been resolved and a replacement is being sent as we speak!! The bulb was dormant when I bought it.
The reason the leaves are trussed up is that it has just been dug up for the photo and was very floppy.
As this came from a reliable source, I would think it is a named variety.
I could ask them if necessary - maybe it is a named one, and being a miserable Scot, I might have to pay them for it!!!!
Cheers
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I was just wondering, on ebay some one sells "Galanthus warei" and they seemed to me rather equal to my Galanthus scharlockii.
Both forms have a spathe that is enormous by comparison with other snowdrops, nivalis or otherwise. But in Scharlockii it splits into two 'ears' and in warei it doesn't split and is possibly even larger. I suspect the two forms may be closely related.
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- can a elwesii, tall and with a big green mark on inner petal give by selfseeding a small elwesii with 2 very distant small green marks ?
I have originally about 12 years ago bought 5 bulbs of G.elwesii from garden center. They were all different from each other and they set seeds. From those seeds there are now many different forms, tall and short, and also the markings vary in the inner petals.
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I think the spathe on Sharlockii is the longest, always clearly split and markings are more defined than in Warei. They are both nivalis forms and Viridipice can look similar - though Warei has a larger spathe.
I don't have 'Warei', but I have 'Viridapice' and also 'Sharlockii' from Germany. S has very long spathe, but the big difference is that 'Viridapice' is huge compared to my 'Sharlockii' which are all quite small, maybe less than 10cm tall. I don't know if there are a lot of variation in the size of 'Scharlockii' and there are also taller S.
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Dear Galanthophiles,
I'm in need of Galanthus ID.
This plant was sold under the name Galanthus elwesii var. monostictus 'Hiemalis' late flowering type. ...and I bought it...
(https://3.bp.blogspot.com/-kKJV4ma38BE/XHL3c2pamwI/AAAAAAABIhY/rsN5XHgDDisSIfpR8Watacws8dNlCfhfQCLcBGAs/s1600/DSC08536%2B-%2B20190222.JPG)
(https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-7sWhANlhqCw/XHL3i4J-rnI/AAAAAAABIhc/0MRW7bO3y8w0lfQBRcqkuagE68TyLl3PQCLcBGAs/s1600/DSC08515%2B-%2B20190213.JPG)
(https://2.bp.blogspot.com/-KmY9TwWx7Ck/XHL3nssYXbI/AAAAAAABIhg/Ct3KHQCp_KQW9kJyVLz1XKFSm9gP95kKgCLcBGAs/s1600/DSC08535%2B-%2B20190222.JPG)
G. elwesii flowers from late January for me, but this is in flower since early January, so I really don't see how this is "late". So anyone can give me a clue what is this?
Fore some more Galanthus pics click (https://magyarviraghagyma.blogspot.com/2019/02/galanthus-and-colchicum-spring-is.html)
Thank you for your help in advance!
Janos
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I'm in need of Galanthus ID.
This plant was sold under the name Galanthus elwesii var. monostictus 'Hiemalis' late flowering type. ...and I bought it...
'Hiemalis' is a generic class of autumn-flowering G. elwesii with a single mark on the apex of the inner segments (i.e. var. monostictus). So it's a late flowering early snowdrop; something of a contradiction - but I have a number of this type that flower around Xmas and so might be considered as such. However the leaves in your picture belong to Galanthus plicatus so what you really have is an early (ish) form of plicatus.
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However the leaves in your picture belong to Galanthus plicatus so what you really have is an early (ish) form of plicatus.
Dear Alan,
Thank you for your reply! I'll change the name. Otherwise it is a nice plant, and I keep it as it has nice big flowers.