Erythronium mix

[Stephenb]

I grew this Erythronium from seed many years ago - the packet was marked "Erythronium mix". Can anyone put a name to it or indicate its parentage. This plant is probably about 10-15 years old from seed and is growing next to a E. dens-canis which has finished flowering when the first flowers of my mixed-up Erythronium appear.

[Lesley Cox]

It looks pretty well what I have as E. oregonum but Mr or Mrs BD will know for sure.

[Diane Whitehead]

Erythronium citrinum has narrow filaments and white anthers.
E. oregonum has filaments that are almost triangular, with the part
at the flower centre wide, narrowing sharply to join the yellow anthers.

However, the citrinums I have seen have had plain yellow centres,
while oregonum has interesting brown markings.

So perhaps this is a hybrid.

[Michael]

OMG THOSE LEAVES!
Do they belong to the same plant? Or are they some kind of Hosta or Calathea?

[Ian Y]

Not citrinum or oregonum - it is Erythronium californicum or very close relative.
From the way it has clumped up the seed was most likely from E. 'White Beauty' although we have forms of californicum that also increase well.
Nice plant.

[Maggi Young]

Michael's reaction is one we often hear from folks seeing a really good form of Erythronium leaf... Yes, they  often are that spectacularly marked. Wonderful, aren't they?

[Stephenb]

Many thanks to all for your help! I can last put a name to one of spring's highlights!!

I've actually planted "White Beauty" twice and have lost it both times. Perhaps my plant has something a bit more hardy mixed in. 

By the way, I thought "White Beauty" was E. revolutum (is that wrong?)

Ian: Could you outline the main diagnostic features for E. californicum?

My plant has never set any seed unfortunately...

Thanks again

Stephen

[Ian Y]

Stephen
'White Beauty' is nothing to do with E. revolutum. That mis-association all started many years ago when a nurseryman had a forgetful moment, as we all do, and wrongly wrote in his catalogue E. revolutum "White Beauty" . Unfortunately many writers still slavishly follow that wrong attribution.
White Beauty is a form of E. californicum and was first mentioned over 100 years ago by Purdy who I think collected it.
The main features of californicum are:- white/cream pollen, filaments slender and nearly uniform in width, creamy white flowers shading to greeny yellow at the base usually with a band of dark red zig zag markings. Several flowers per stem and mottled leaves

[Michael]

Yes Maggi, they are from other world. I thought that the erythronium bulb flowered leafless and was planted among other hosta-type leafy plant! That's great, you have wonderfull leaves, and a big bonus, those yellow flowers! Better is impossible!

[ashley]

To my eye, Stephen’s plant differs from Ian’s example of ‘White Beauty’ in foliage, flower shape & colouring.  Is this degree of variability possible?

[Ian Y]

Ashley you are correct to point out the differences between the 'White Beauty' I posted and Stephen's picture.
However I said that I suspect that Stephen's plant may have been raised from seed collected from 'White Beauty' . ' 
'White Beauty'  sets viable seed most years but not as many as other forms of E. californicum we grow however none of these other forms increases as well as 'White Beauty' .
I have raised many plants from this 'White Beauty' seed and yes there is a variation but all are distinctly related to E. californicum.
It will only be when they carry out a DNA profile that we will learn if 'White Beauty'  is just a form of californicum or if it has hybridised out but for now all the morphological features place it in E. californicum.

[Maggi Young]

Quote from Paul Tyerman:

Ashley,

I think Ian was saying that it is a seedling of 'White Beauty', not that it actually is that.  'White Beauty' is obviously a particular plant selected for certain qualities..... so the offspring could be quite variable.  It all depends on what the parentage of WB was like.  I think one of the main things for WB is that it offsets readily, making it a viable commercial plant.  Given Stephen's plant has offset into a large clump it has inherited this trait from it's parents, making it more likely that something like WB was the parent. Or at least that is how I read Ian's comment anyway. 

[ashley]

Point taken, Ian and Paul, that this lies within the expected range of ex ‘White Beauty’.   

[Rodger Whitlock]

It's E. helenae or possibly, though less likely, E. multiscapoideum.

As E. helenae is the only fragrant Erythronium, a sniff next spring will resolve the issue.

BTW, if that "Erythronium mix" seed came from the Alpine Garden Club of British Columbia, it was from me.

The Jepson manual of the flora of California is a good reference for identifying erythroniums native to the Pacific slope.

Re the discussion of E. 'White Beauty': a botanist at our local university is a specialist in Erythronium and after examining a patch of 'White Beauty' concluded it is pure E. californicum with no trace of hybridity. The usual wild form does not have the rounded petal tips of White Beauty', but that's not a botanically significant characteristic.

I have a single bulb of a white form of E. revolutum and it is a vastly different affair.

[Ian Y]

Re the discussion of E. 'White Beauty': a botanist at our local university is a specialist in Erythronium and after examining a patch of 'White Beauty' concluded it is pure E. californicum with no trace of hybridity. The usual wild form does not have the rounded petal tips of White Beauty', but that's not a botanically significant characteristic.

Thank you for the very interesting comments on 'White Beauty' they confirm what I think.

I am not sure about Stephen's Erythronium being E. helenae I am still using Applegate and from his description there should be no brown/red markings and the pollen should be golden yellow.

E. helenae

I think that the scapes are way too developed for it to be E. multiscapoideum which has a truncated scape that hardly extends beyond the leaf bases.


Erythronium multiscapoideum

I could accept the argument for it being a hybrid between E. californicum and E. helenae as I have similar hybrids of that parentage and in cultivation hybrids do appear regularily.