arisarum for identification

[arillady]

A friend was asking what the correct id is of this Arisarum(?)

[Paul T]

Pat,

It's an Arum, not an Arisarum.  Does your friend recall what the leaves are like?  By the look of it the plant flowers with no leaves at all?

[arillady]

You can see Paul how much I know about these plants. I believe the photos were taken in Provence, France when the friend was there:
"I've also enclosed one of a really weird looking arum in front of the hotel that could be A. creticum." Uhm I should have read her email more closely before posting the photos.

[Paul T]

Pat,

Arum creticum I don't "think" has flowers shaped like that.  I've never flowered my plants of what is supposed to be that species.  The flowers in the pic look very much like Arum italicum or "Lords and Ladies", but those flower with the leaves already up so I am thinking that isn't what it actually is?

[David Shaw]

My Arum creticum are on a longer stalk and have leaves when in flower. The ground in this picture looks pretty dry and baked but mine never gets like that.

[Paul T]

David,

That confirms what I was thinking of A. creticum looking like..... smaller flowers, and on stems rather than the large flowers sitting on the ground.  The fact it is flowering without any leaves is the really strange thing.  The flowers look like italicum, but I've never seen any flowers without leaves.

[Woodmyst]

Hello,
  New to the forum and been looking around, but I couldn't resist this one.  I live in Northern lower Michigan, USA.  I also see these popping up all over in late spring.  I have to lean on the side of Arisaema Triphyllum Or Jack in the pulpit.  Some turn darker with age but a lot of the early woodland plants indiginous to this region flower first and then leaf.  I see them around the same time as trilliums and morels.  Just a thought.

[Tony Willis]

I would say its Arum maculatum which covers most of Europe and is common in France. When the spring flowering arums flower they are at the point of dying down and their leaves are drying of. If they have had a dry season as they come into flower the leaves have disappeared. The seed heads then remain stuck up like lolly pops ripening.

Woodmyst, arisaema does not grow in Europe I wish they did.

Paul this is arum creticum which has a very distinctive shape

Arum creticum

[Maggi Young]

The flowers of Arum creticum, as can be seen from Tony's photo, are of a very sturdy, waxy nature.

I have never seen an Arum maculatum flower without its leaves.

The seed heads then remain stuck up like lolly pops ripening.

Very poisonous lollipops!

Welcome to the Forum, Woodmyst!
As Tony says, Arisaema  are not native to Europe.


I see that your Profile Signature says "Only 20 acres to garden in, what am I supposed to do with that?!".... What a wonderful dilemma to have! As long as your back holds out, I'd say the answer was plant anything and everything and see what does best! What great fun you will have!!

[Tony Willis]

Looking at the distribution maps the other possibility is Arum italicum as being together with A. alpinum the only ones found (native) in that area. It is not A. alpinum and without leaves tubers and then the flowers to pull apart it is not possible to be definitive.

Maggie thank you for gently correcting my English, arisaemas do of course grow in Europe but are not native.

[Paul T]

Tony,

That was my recollection of what Arum creticum should look like, but mine has never flowered.

Woodmyst,

Arisaema triphyllum flowers with it's leaves, the flower sits between the leaves.  Height depends on form, but the flowers would never sit on the ground without any leaf present.  Plus, I don't recall ever hearing of any yellow forms?  All I've seen or heard of range from green through to brown, all with a distinctly hooded flower which covers the spadix, unlike in the original picture.  I'd virtually guarantee it is an Arum or Biarum, and still think that it is most likely Arum italicum. 

[Alessandro.marinello]

this is Arum italicum is sure

[arillady]

Now I have to rack my brain to work out who was the friend who wanted this plant identified.
It does seem to be Arum italicum.
Thanks all for the interesting discussion.
Pat