Muscari & relatives 2013

[Rimmer de Vries]

Rimmer, the only visible difference is the color:
H. lazulina has a unique, very deep purple/blue color while H. heldreichii is sky blue.
In fact at first H. lazulina was thought to be only a color form of H. heldreichii but chromosome number indicates it to be a different species.

Thanks Oron, is the attached picture correctly identified as H. lazulina?

Rimmer

[Gail]

Wow, that is a fantastic colour - so intense. 

[Hans A.]

Rimmer - I think it is correct, apologies for the picture of H. lazulina I posted earlier - I took it with flashlight  - without flashlight (but a bit out of focus) it looks similar to yours.
Oron - I know H. heldreichii as deep (violet) blue. 
( like this: http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg82882#msg82882 )

[Oron Peri]

Rimmer - I think it is correct, apologies for the picture of H. lazulina I posted earlier - I took it with flashlight  - without flashlight (but a bit out of focus) it looks similar to yours.
Oron - I know H. heldreichii as deep (violet) blue. 
( like this: http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg82882#msg82882 )

Thanks Hans!
I caused a confusion here,
here is how it meant to be:

Rimmer, the only visible difference is the color:
H. lazulina heldreichii has a unique, very deep purple/blue color while H. heldreichii lazolina is sky blue with dark blue midrib.
In fact at first H. lazulina was thought to be only a color form of H. heldreichii but chromosome number indicates it to be a different species.

[Rimmer de Vries]

Thanks for your help
Oron,  your original post corresponded with my labeling from well know suppliers but your correction has really confused me.

i have Hyacinthella lazulina as the intense deep purple blue color and H. heldreichii  as the one with a darker mid rib 

is the difference only from DNA or are there some other field attributes to distinguish between the two other than color?

i included 2 photos from last April of what i thought was H. heldreichii showing the dark mid rib with some sun back light- grown in a cold frame

and one photo of Hyacinthella lazulina with glaucous leaves almost prostrate against the soil- grown in a pot in a foam fish box in the open (last winter was not a winter here)


Rimmer
SE Michigan
 USA Zone 5

[Janis Ruksans]

I have received a bulb of this Bellevalia from Janis as Bellevalia sp. RRW9913.
After having the exact location from Bob Wallis, it all fitted to Bellevalia densiflora. It is the first time photo of this species is shown. Distributed in NW Syria and NE Lebanon.

Many thanks Oron for identification.
Janis

[Oron Peri]

Rimmer,

The color seems to be the only visible difference. As such i think it is problematic to decide by the photos as the Blue color changes much from one camera to the other and appear differently according to light level.
Also we need to consider that with in each population there are darker and lighter color forms.

There are other samples like this where not knowing  the original location there is no way you can tell which species it is, such in the Oncocyclus Iris, Romulea and others.

Probably if you put the two species side by side it would be easier to distinguish.
The leaves of both are mostly flat on the ground unless they grow in the shade of a rock etc. then they will be erect as they look for the sun.

[Rimmer de Vries]

Muscari adilii as offered by Paul Christian in frame today open to out side temps

Rimmer

[daveyp1970]

That s soooo different to mine Rimmer

[daveyp1970]

And a few more.
muscari leucostomum from RRW Collection

muscari coeleste

[Rimmer de Vries]

That s soooo different to mine

Davey yours is much farther along and has a bi colour. 
mine is just emerging from dormancy
Last year this bulb did not have bi color. the seed pod appears the same as shown in Janis Ruksans Buried Treasures book.

[daveyp1970]

I can't remember if mine has swollen pods i think it does,in any case you have super plants

[pehe]

My Muscari adilii from Paul Christian also have relative large seed pods, but it looks quite different from M. adilii from Janis Ruksans.

Poul

[pehe]

Some other Muscari:

Muscari coeleste
Muscari azureum
Muscari aucheri 'Autumn Glory' with two flowers. The first appeared in October and now another flower is appearing. (Which is normal for this selection)

Poul

[Maggi Young]

My Muscari adilii from Paul Christian also have relative large seed pods, but it looks quite different from M. adilii from Janis Ruksans.

and Davey- isn't your plant there the one identified a couple of years ago as NOT being M. adillii?


Janis'  as shown here http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg87321#msg87321   
( other examples are to be found in the forum)  are, I think, from the locus classicus and are identical to those  seen shown in slides by Prof. Guner.