Paeonia 2013

[astragalus]

Paeonia peregrina starting to bloom.  It was started from a very small division.

[Matt]

Very nice peony, Thomas. 
Mine is still in bud, perhaps a week more before it opens.
The "normal" P.obovata is almost finished with flowering, this picture is from day before yesterday, morning.
Now is also flowering an unknown early hybrid, possibly with P.wittmanniana. I like this peony very much, it opens with a flush of pink but fades to pure white. I have also 'Fan Tan', which starts to flower over a week later than this peony and they grow close to each other.

yes your plant looks morphologically like P. kevachensis.

your obovatas...what a glory!!! the pleasure of gardening in cooler climates with reliable rainfall...very rare pleasures indeed!

m.

[Matt]

From the deepest south...Paeonia peregrina in the wild in Calabria (S. Italy...the toe of the boot...).

The peonies in their thousands, the sun, the blue sky, the sea on the horizon, the crickets, the birds and the wind...impossible to describe with words...thx to Angelo & Filippo.

M.

[Gail]

Wow, Astragalus's garden plant of peregrina is beautiful but to see them in the wild like that would be such a great joy. Thank you everyone for all the peony pictures.

If anyone is near Wisley on Sunday there should be some peonies to admire;
http://www.peonysoc.com/peony%20society%20news.htm

[astragalus]

A whole hillside of Paeonia peregrine - what a wonderful sight that must have been.

[Matt]

Hello,
after a long break here again a few pictures of my Peonies - some bloom here for the first time (after a long time from seed to bud)
Here are pictures of P.peregrina - I got these seeds from botanists, they were collected in the Ionian Islands.
These plants are slightly different from my P.peregrina from Calabria ...

Have fun
Hans

Could it be P. saueri?

Hong De-Yuan says that P. saueri differs with P. peregrina in having leaflets mostly entire, instead of dentate-lobed, that are hispidulous beneath, instead of glabrous, and in having red stigmas, instead of yellow/pale pink.

From your images this seems the case (are the leaves slightly hairy beneath?).
For comparison, attached is a close detail of a flower of wild P. peregrina from Calabria

There is also a provenance issue. HdY considers as type a collection on Mt. Pangeon near Kavala in NE Greece...quite far away from the Ionian Islands.
HdY also refers to an "additional specimen examined" from Melesine in S Albania...collected in 1933...(no comment!...we love the zealous botanists don't we?).
However this location could be compatible with the Ionian Islands...in particular Kerkyra (Corfù) and Paxi are very close.

What do you think?

More comments?

M.

[Leena]

How wonderful it must have been to see all those peonies in the wild, thank you for the pictures.

[Hans J]

Could it be P. saueri?

Hong De-Yuan says that P. saueri differs with P. peregrina in having leaflets mostly entire, instead of dentate-lobed, that are hispidulous beneath, instead of glabrous, and in having red stigmas, instead of yellow/pale pink.

From your images this seems the case (are the leaves slightly hairy beneath?).
For comparison, attached is a close detail of a flower of wild P. peregrina from Calabria

There is also a provenance issue. HdY considers as type a collection on Mt. Pangeon near Kavala in NE Greece...quite far away from the Ionian Islands.
HdY also refers to an "additional specimen examined" from Melesine in S Albania...collected in 1933...(no comment!...we love the zealous botanists don't we?).
However this location could be compatible with the Ionian Islands...in particular Kerkyra (Corfù) and Paxi are very close.

What do you think?

More comments?

M.

Matt ,

I had a similar idea like you with P.saueri....I dont know...
Sure - the stigma is red in opposite to those P.peregrina from Calabria ...the Problem is like always: the plants have no labels in her habitat 

Here is a link to P.saueri :
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=3636.msg95553#msg95553

Maybe you should go to compere this plants from Ionian Islands and P.saueri ...

Hans

[Catwheazle]

hi,
Despite cold and steady rain to grow and flourish ....
got as Paeonia officinalis "Monte baldensis". (what is the difference between "normal")

[Matt]

hi,
Despite cold and steady rain to grow and flourish ....
get as Paeonia officinalis "Monte baldensis". (what is the difference between "normal")

Exactly!...what is the difference? LOL

P. officinalis ssp banatica from Serbia & Hungary and P. officinalis ssp humilis (also called ssp villosa) from the Western Prealps (French side) are morphologically very distinct from "normal" P. officinalis...one doesn't need to be a botanist to spot the difference!

From what I have seen - the Italian plants from Mt Baldo near Verona - the plants from Abruzzo (the now so called ssp italica) and the plants from the Eastern Prealps & Carso are all the same: P. officinalis ssp officinalis. The only Italian population that seems morphologically distinct (I haven't visited it yet) is the one from the Apennine Mountains south of Modena. HdY says it is P. arietina...we will see.

I do admit that there might be a certain degree of polymorphism within the same population of "normal" P. officinalis esp in the shape of the leaves (the plants from Mt Lanaro near Trieste - for example - can vary quite a lot) but is this enough to define new subspecies?

I am not a botanist...so I am interested in names up to a certain point...when one has the correct provenance of a wild collected plant one doesn't need more in my opinion.

The poet said "What's in a name? That which we call a rose - By any other name would smell as sweet."

M.

[Thomas Seiler]

Wow, Matt, what great shots from P. peregrina in the wild! Almost incredible, these populations, and that you took all the troubles to get there at the right moment!

Yes, the provenance, that's the most important thing, but unfortunately  mostly it is lost ... when plants are growing in gardens.. . and the plants grown from seeds are getting hybrids.  What's in a name, maybe we shouldn't take things too serious ... :-)  I am a botanist, but it's not my profession, so I can just enjoy the pants ... LOL

[David Nicholson]

Is anyone else finding a lack of flowers on their Paeonia this year?

From seed (SRGC 07/2676) sown June 2008 Paeonia delavayi ssp. angustiloba. I also have P. delavayi lutea but not a single flower this year.

[David Nicholson]

Is it P. anomala, or is it P. veitchii, or is it P. anomala ssp. veitchii???

[Catwheazle]

Does someone have information about Paeonia parnassica ?
Is their color really so dark as shown in the book of Josef Halda?
(From him i got the most of my Paeony seed.)
- unfortunately no parnassica 
regards
Bernd

[Thomas Seiler]

No information, but photographs, though not from my garden.
Paeonia parnassica: