Cypripedium franchetii cultivation help?

[Corrado & Rina]

Thanks to everybody!

1) Anthony: it sounds like macranthos will be one of the first to join. I still have some perplexities about the raised beds in the specific environment .... the garden is not too big, and I am not sure we would be able to control the temperature appropriately.

2) David: thanks for the suggestions. I had read about the existence of x ventricosum, but set it aside. I think I will definitively consider it, in light of what you say. Concerning compost, thanks, it is very helpful. I just have to find the right fertilisation regime now ....

3)

Reading through Phil Cribb's 'The Genus cypripedium', he says: "I have seen Cypripedium franchetii several times in western and northern Sichuan, growing amongst grasses and small bushes of rhododendron on banks or terraces above fast-flowing rivers at between 2000 and 3000 m elevation...."

The reference to rhododendron may indicate that this species prefers a more acid substrate.

Thanks this is very useful. I would make the same assumption. Yet, it looks like Cribb is describing an alpine environment: if the Rhododendron he saw, was a relative of R. hirsutum, which is widespread on the alps, it could grow in mildly basic soil! Off the top of my head, I cannot think of any Chinese alpine Rhododendron that grows in the same conditions as R. hirsutum though. If we knew which Rhododendron was seen by Cribb :-) it would be useful. I have found some documentation suggesting ph 7.0, which seems a bit a bit like sitting on the fence .... :-)

Going back to fertilisation, you seems all very experienced, and I am going to take advantage of your kindness again!

1) What liquid fertiliser do you normally use and at what concentration? What NPK?

2) Maren, would you use your 600microS rule also for franchetii and allies? Do you apply any ph correction in case of very hard water?

3) We use horticultural grade Maxicrop Plus Sequestered Iron as tonic for all our potted plants. It provides essential micro nutrients and the sequestered iron compensates the deficiencies that may be caused by the very hard water. We buy it in trade quantities, so we reduce the costs. Do you think it could be helpful for the Cypripedium as well?

Thanks a lot, sorry for all questions!

[monocotman]

I use the normally available white powders as feed like phostrogen or miracle gro.
They don't need the more expensive liquid feeds like Maxicrop.
Later in the season they receive tomato feed to help root growth.
They also receive Epsom salts very occasionally if the foliage looks pale.
The rule of thumb is full rate feed for hybrids (and x ventricosum) and quarter rate for species.
Early in the season I feed every week, as the shoots are growing.
This is when the plants need most of their annual nitrogen as they are making shoots and leaves very quickly. Later on every 2 weeks or when I remember.
It isn't so critical.
The latest book on cyps, from Frosch and Cribb states that you can feed at higher rates (double) early in the season during shoot development, so I'm trying this advice for the first time this year.
I try to use rain water for most of my watering and feeding but if it runs out, as is likely at some point during the year, I use my local hard tap water. I've never seen any harmful effects from using it,
Regards,
David

[Anthony Darby]

Small garden and raised beds would be ideal for cypripediums. I could walk round my garden in 18 seconds and it was mostly raised beds. It kept the plants above the water table. The local substrate was acidic and I used water straight from the tap.

[Maren]

Hi,
I don't grow C. franchetii, so cannot advise on its culture from experience, and I don't recommend things unless I know for sure. I use my 600microsiemens rule pretty much on everything, including pleiones, which form by far the larger part of things I grow. As we have very hard water in our area, I try to feed only with rainwater, because that gives me more scope for nutrients. If I use tap water for feeding with an automatic dilutor, I use a Peters fertiliser for hard water.

[Corrado & Rina]

At the Harrogate Flower Show I met with Jeff from Laneside .... and the inevitable happened: franchetii has two new friends.

1) Cypripedium macranthos album (a white clone)
2) Cypripedium tibeticum

EDROM nursery had Cypripedium bardolphianum W.W.Sm. & Farrer  and I asked him if he was willing to part with it: I think he is still laughing now. Ops.

[monocotman]

Good buys!
Both species are straight forward to grow and in time can develop into large multi shoot plants.
Just be careful with macranthos and winter cold. If it is too cold then the buds will abort although shoot growth will be unaffected.
Maren - do you use the 600 microsiemens limit for both species and hybrids?

Regards,

David

[Maren]

David, I'm convinced I answered this, but maybe I didn't press the send button. The answer is yes, but the amount of food given varies with the type of water I use. If it's tap water (ours is 500 microsiemens), then they get rather less food. This means I have to feed more often, but it's less work, because I can use a dilutor. That's why I prefer to use rainwater (13 microsiemens) when I am feeding, but that's a bit back breaking because then I have to use a watering can (no electricity for a pump, unfortunately).

[monocotman]

Maren,
thanks for the information.
I'm going to play with feed strengths for the species and hybrids this year,
David

[Corrado & Rina]

Dear Maren,

Apologies for yet another round of questions:

1) What type of conductivity meter do you use? Do you use a cheap basic meter (<£20.00) or do you need lab grade meter (much more expensive)?  In other words, is there some tolerance into the process?

2) What type of dilutor do you use? We are thinking of moving to a dilutor connected to the hose pipes to reduce the back breaking task of watering with watering cans. We have Gardena hose attacks.

3) I do not understand why a dilutor cannot be used in the second case (13mS). Can you elaborate? I was hoping to be able to use it for both low and high concentration fertilisation.

Questions for everybody:

We do not seem to be able to find any information on the average hardness of the water in our area, we assumed the utility companies would have been compelled to publish it. Is that the case?

Thanks a lot.

[Peter Maguire]

Hi Corradoerina,

If you're looking for water quality figures, it is likely to be on your water company's website. I found our local water hardness (and a lot of other stuff) by typing 'water hardness' into the search box on our company's (Northumbrian Water) website homepage, then you can enter your postcode.
You give your location as 'North-east'. If you're also a Northumbrian Water customer, the page link is:
http://www.nwl.co.uk/your-home/your-account/your-area.aspx?returnUrl=http://www.nwl.co.uk/your-home/your-account/in-your-area/water-quality.aspx

[Corrado & Rina]

Hi Peter,

Unfortunately, our provider, who-shall-not-be-named,  provides the service, but it does not work .... see http://www.yorkshirewater.com/extra-services/in-your-area.aspx

Best,
Corrado

[Peter Maguire]

Two options then:
1. send off an email to them requesting the information, I believe that they do have a duty to provide it. (Your link worked for me when I tried a few random postcodes for people that I know in Yorkshire - but not for every postcode, and it's never heard of Harrogate!)
2. move  - the scenery's lovely in Northumberland. 

Peter

[Anthony Darby]

The second one is similar to the response I get when I order certain things from Amazon. 

[Corrado & Rina]

I sent an email, we will see .... we accept bets on the likely answer. :-)

[Maren]

Hi corradoerina,
in answer to your questions:

1) Conductivity meter: I have several, my favourite is Hanna which cost around £70, but they are making cheaper ones now. I'm sure a bit of tolerance is tolerated.
2) Dilutor: mine is an Access AD3, about £100+, the type you can move around (some don't like to be moved).
3) Why can't I use my dilutor with rainwater? because the dilutor is driven by the pressure of mains water. Rainwater is static, it simply sits in its butt and doesn't drive anything. If I wanted to use the dilutor with rainwater, I would have to use an electrical pump to provide the necessary pressure. There is no electricity at the greenhouse. I hope this answers your questions.

Your general question about hardiness: I contacted my local water company and their stats confirm that we are in a hard water area. So does my conductivity meter.