Regulatory threats to seed exchanges and plant movements

[Hillview croconut]

 ;Dx

[Maggi Young]

  It would appear a bit of a cop out to urge members to get behind this whilst not being involved itself. Just a thought ....

This forum, unless stated otherwise, expresses the views of the forumists - no more no less.

There are those  of us who feel this is an important matter and are prepared to get involved as best we can and to encourage others to do the same.

Some  probably do think that a "corporate " view  would be helpful. There  may even be those who feel that the SRGC as an entity should have no place in such matters.

It seems to me, personally, that such legislation could be a death knell to Seed Exchanges like that of the SRGC and our sister societies and to many of the specialist nurseries that are so dear to our  interest and members.

For me, that is worth working for.

[Hillview croconut]

It would appear a bit of a cop out to urge members to get behind this whilst not being involved itself. Just a thought ....

Mmm ... maybe I should have put this a different way 

I have a view, Maggi has a view and I am sure many others have a view but does the SRGC have a view? Or should it?
Personally I think as a stakeholder with a lot to lose it most definitely should have. And after all, at a guess, it probably has 15,000 EU members and that's a lot of heft in comparison to one individual. It could also offer some leadership in relation to shaping interest and opinion. It could also be acting in concert with the AGS to put forward their member's special concerns and considerations.

This should not be a controversial issue and the potential loss of something as attractive and valuable as the Seed Exchange for starters should be sufficient reason to definitely get a view and rally the troops.

Cheers, Marcus

[meanie]

As predicted, still no reply from my MEP. I forwarded it to my local MP, but he has been too busy taking "selfies" in SA this week to reply!!!!

So where to now as an individual? The Green Party was a good thought and so it has been handed on to my local rep. They always get my vote at a local level, so no maybe it is time for them to stand up and be counted at a national level.

Civil disobedience? I could sell someone a cutting of (for example) S.perscandens which is almost certainly too much of a niche product to get registered for a quid and then "dob" myself in. But for this to be effective (even if only to make a point) it would need a few thousand people to do the same, all on the same day, notifying the relevant authority by way of registered post. Who on earth would want to co-ordinate that?

Has anyone forwarded this issue to 38degrees.org?

[Hillview croconut]

A civil disobedience project of mass postings to the EC of selfies "in the act of criminality" involving poking one's tongue out  ?

[Palustris]

I would not be surprised if this comes to pass, that it is the Organisers of an event where plants are sold 'illegally' who are prosecuted not the individual plant seller.


Death knell to the Members plant stalls at shows!

[meanie]

A civil disobedience project of mass postings to the EC of selfies "in the act of criminality" involving poking one's tongue out  ?

A solution as absurd as the proposed legislation - like it!

[meanie]

I would not be surprised if this comes to pass, that it is the Organisers of an event where plants are sold 'illegally' who are prosecuted not the individual plant seller.


Death knell to the Members plant stalls at shows!

So everyone selling becomes a member of the committee then?

Not the death knell as long as the stalls only sell approved plants. So yes, the death knell as far as I'm concerned.
There's a village near here that holds an annual plant sale in aid of the village hall. It is well supported by the villagers and well attended not only by the locals but by gardeners from miles around owing to the plants that are on offer. I missed out on a Fuchsia boliviana by but three steps (it's like the January sales when the doors open) for £2 - if they can't sell such rarities then ultimately it will be the community that misses out.

[Hillview croconut]

There's a village near here that holds an annual plant sale in aid of the village hall. It is well supported by the villagers and well attended not only by the locals but by gardeners from miles around owing to the plants that are on offer. I missed out on a Fuchsia boliviana by but three steps (it's like the January sales when the doors open) for £2 - if they can't sell such rarities then ultimately it will be the community that misses out.

These are the stories that never make it to the rarefied air of the EC committee rooms.  Decisions like the one we confront here never pay any attention to the damage to community, to local participation,  or to cultural amenity. All that matters is business and governance. The greatest threat to liberty has been the rise of managerialism. A creeping, clogging malaise with no cure and no comfort.

[Giles]

If one takes this legislation to its logical conclusion, all that will be left for people to grow will be F₁ hybrid seed strains, and vegetatively propagated cultivars which are covered by plant breeders rights (as these will be the only seeds and plants that breeders will be able to get a return on, to cover the cultivars registration process).

[johnralphcarpenter]

If things go on like this, gardeners will become the second largest class of criminals (after motorists). Its already too easy to break the law, in the EU anyway, with restrictions on pesticides for example. When I was studying at Hadlow College a fellow student suggested using dilute washing-up liquid in a spay for aphids; she was told that this would be illegal as washing-up liquid is not an approved pesticide. Armillatox was developed as a fungicide for Honey Fungus (the clue is in the name), but it is now illegal to use it for that in the EU. I could go on.....

[meanie]

If one takes this legislation to its logical conclusion, all that will be left for people to grow will be F₁ hybrid seed strains, and vegetatively propagated cultivars which are covered by plant breeders rights (as these will be the only seeds and plants that breeders will be able to get a return on, to cover the cultivars registration process).

If the letter of the law is followed then yes.
However, as John says.....................

If things go on like this, gardeners will become the second largest class of criminals (after motorists). Its already too easy to break the law, in the EU anyway, with restrictions on pesticides for example. When I was studying at Hadlow College a fellow student suggested using dilute washing-up liquid in a spay for aphids; she was told that this would be illegal as washing-up liquid is not an approved pesticide. Armillatox was developed as a fungicide for Honey Fungus (the clue is in the name), but it is now illegal to use it for that in the EU. I could go on.....

The idiocy of the EU summed up really. So whilst I cannot legally use a drop of washing-up liquid to sort the whitefly out, I can (in fact I'm probably encouraged) if I want chuck the washing up water over the beds instead of using fresh water from the tap.
Sad thing is that I'm actually in favour of the basic concept of the EU. And it would be disastrous for us economically to leave now. But we just keep on putting idiots into the European parliament.

[Gene Mirro]

All extremism should be opposed by reasonable people.  Especially the kind of self-serving extremism that comes from big expensive bureaucracies.  They will chip away at your personal liberties until there is nothing left.  And all because they feel insecure about their employment.  This is happening because of the passivity of the average citizen.

[meanie]

All extremism should be opposed by reasonable people.  Especially the kind of self-serving extremism that comes from big expensive bureaucracies.  They will chip away at your personal liberties until there is nothing left.  And all because they feel insecure about their employment.  This is happening because of the passivity of the average citizen.

Whilst I tend to agree, let us not forget that the seed (no pun intended) of these ideas come from non elected interested parties, be they big business, the human rights industry, etc.

On a constructive note, I have a local Green Party activist coming around on Monday to discuss this issue. He is a keen allotment grower and was blissfully unaware of the proposed legislation, or to be more precise the far reaching ramifications of it.

[Palustris]

Discussing this with someone on Friday night, I was told that as far as he knew, the British government have stated that they will refuse to implement this legislation if it comes to pass. Cannot find any official announcement to this end though.