Galanthus in January 2014

[Maggi Young]

I have a notion that Corrin and Megan may be derived from Warburg seedlings, too, Brian .

Oddly enough,  most of the G. nivalis in my front garden are Welsh!  A gift from a Welsh friend many years ago who had a lot of snowdrops  growing well on her small farm - no named types though -  " just  snowdrops"!

[Maggi Young]

Hello everyone,
A friend suggested that I ask if any SRGC members can tell me whether there are any named snowdrop varieties/cultivars which have a confirmed origin in Wales - we garden in west Wales where many snowdrops seem to thrive, but as yet I haven't come across any named ones with a definite Welsh origin/source. Any ideas would be gratefully received. Since this is a first post, apologies if it's not been placed in the correct way!
Thanks Julian

Julian,
I'll email you with contact details for Bob and Rannveig Wallis - They'll be a great source of information I'm sure, since they grow such an amazing range of blubs.

[Alan_b]

The late Simon Savage was based in Shropshire and introduced a number of new snowdrops which he found 'in the wild'.  He gave a talk at the Galanthus Gala in 2008 but I cannot remember if he crossed the border into Wales to find his introductions.

Or if you know anywhere in Wales with a large seeding population of snowdrops then give me a few hours and I could probably find something worth cultivating and possibly ultimately naming, if it thrived.

[Thomas Seiler]

The late Simon Savage? Goodness, I remember his talk and bought some of his snowdrops. He was still quite a young man!

[Maggi Young]

The late Simon Savage? Goodness, I remember his talk and bought some of his snowdrops. He was still quite a young man!

 Brian  told us the news of Simon Savage's passing  on September  1st 2012 :

http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=9396.msg255078#msg255078

John Grimshaw wrote an appreciation :  http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.co.uk/2012/12/simon-savage-1965-2012.html

[Thomas Seiler]

Thank you Maggi, I missed that ... sad news for me now.

[Carolyn Walker]

Hello everyone,
A friend suggested that I ask if any SRGC members can tell me whether there are any named snowdrop varieties/cultivars which have a confirmed origin in Wales - we garden in west Wales where many snowdrops seem to thrive, but as yet I haven't come across any named ones with a definite Welsh origin/source. Any ideas would be gratefully received. Since this is a first post, apologies if it's not been placed in the correct way!
Thanks Julian

Welcome to the forum, Julian.  If there is any group that can help you track down Welsh snowdrops it's this group.  You already have Alan volunteering to track them down in person on Welsh soil!  With your penchant for science and investigation, you will also enjoy all the technical discussions that take place here.

[Alan_b]

Some nivalis populations seem to be sterile.  For example, if you go here http://www.wheddoncross.org.uk/snowdropvalley.htm you will see large numbers of snowdrops but few if any seedlings and very little difference between the snowdrops.  Seedlings produce a narrow single leaf and, although a damaged bulb can do the same, unless something is badly wrong you wouldn't expect to see a large proportion of damaged bulbs.  Whereas in a seeding population of snowdrops you should see a large number of seedlings.

Wherever you find a large seeding population of snowdrops you will see much more variation between individuals and if you look often enough and hard enough you will eventually find something that might be worthy of cultivation.  You then need to cosset it and observe it for a few years to make sure it multiplies and comes true.  If it has good qualities and is distinguishable for the large number of snowdrops that already have a name then it might be worthy of being named itself.  And name or no-name, you will probably have grown attached to it by then and want to keep it going.

[Olive Mason]

'Welshway occure in the garden of Hilary Purkiss in Gloucestershire.  It was named after the old road on which her house stands so sadly has no connection with Wales

[Tim Ingram]

Wonderful detective story developing! I wonder if Jim and Jenny Archibald had any special snowdrops that occurred in their garden? Species snowdrop seed was sometimes listed by them I think and could be given honorary Welsh origins! Looks like this could be a whole new terrain for snowdrop lovers.

[Alan_b]

This talk of snowdrop origins made me review my own named snowdrop find, 'Green Light'.  This came from a wood near the border between Cambridgeshire and Suffolk but to my surprise, I found I was actually in Suffolk and not Cambridgeshire when I found it (the opposite of what I had always thought I knew, but never verified).  So add one to the tally for Suffolk and strike one off the tally for Cambridgeshire.   

[Tim Harberd]

Hi Julian,
   A slightly tenuous connection… but.. 'Mrs Macnamara' is reported to have been named after Dylan Thomas’s mother-in-law… (and is sometimes grown as ‘Milkwood’!)

Tim DH

[johnw]

Some nivalis populations seem to be sterile.

Alan  - Such seems to be the case here, the largest & oldest nivalis stands seem to produce zero seed.  Is this a ploidy issue?

johnw 

[Alan_b]

Can you get ploidy issues within a single species?  I thought they arose with inter-species hybrids.

Much of the UK nivalis population may derive from a very few bulbs brought here originally for use in religious ceremony.  For example, the Exmoor population I cited as sterile has clearly been there a very long time.  If the original gene pool was small, perhaps selection processes then favoured a sterile snowdrop.  Then I suspect many of the well-established nivalis populations in Nova Scotia might derive originally from the UK.       

[johnw]

Then I suspect many of the well-established nivalis populations in Nova Scotia might derive originally from the UK.

Alan  - I think you are quite correct, they certainly would pre-date the advent of Dutch imports.

re: ploidy issues  I think you can, at least it seems to be the case within Appalachian azalea species.  I suppose one aberrant nivalis tetraploid could cross (as the pollen parent) with other regular nivalis and produce sterile triploids.  I defer to anyone with a grasp of these matters.........

johnw