Remarks from the Weekly KAVB Flower Show - Lisse

[Lvandelft]

Regarding Allium "auctum", the species name is an invalid one, which depending on the original author citation, refer instead to A. cyrillii, decipiens, or a pink-flowered form of A. nigrum.  I've grown plants under the "auctum" name twice, one plant ended up being A. nigrum in a nice pink form (looks like your plant) and the other time it ended up being A. cyrillii (which I was pleased with, because A. cyrillii in horticulture is usually replaced by Allium senescens).

Thanks Mark for these interesting comments about A. loratum, which I will pass to the KAVB nomenclature Committee for further discussions.

The so called repeating mistakes sound rather familiar to me and I think that there are for sure more Allium names with the same problem.
I will put a picture of another Allium which seems to suffer under the same problem in the Allium thread.

This dwarf alpine species is published in The Journal of Botany, British and Foreign, article entitled "On the Alliums of India, China, and Japan", by J.G. Baker, Vol.III page 290, published 1874.  The description of Allium loratum also appears in The Flora of British India by Sir J.D. Hooker, Vol. VI. Orchideae to Cyperaceae, published in 1894.  I'm happy to scan and post the original latin description and the later english description for everyone to see first hand.

Interesting to read in the Flora of India that Baker says about A. loratum:
Judging for the very imperfect specimens, closely resembles Allium narcissifolium, Linn…

Now to the next one, Allium “auctum”:
Wietse writes: Allium auctum was found by us on Crete. We always called it a pink form of Allium nigrum, but were told that it might be Allium auctum and since we put that name to it.
We do have Allium cyrillii as well and in my eyes best compared with a longer/bigger form of Allium senescens, (of which we have about 20 different types).

[TheOnionMan]

Interesting to read in the Flora of India that Baker says about A. loratum:
Judging for the very imperfect specimens, closely resembles Allium narcissifolium, Linn…

Actually, it is Sir J.D. Hooker that adds English commentary to the Allium loratum entry in Flora of India in 1894, not Baker; but it must be remembered that Baker's original latin publication of the species 20 years earlier describes a dwarf alpine species with white flowers, and in Baker's 1874 publication where a number of new species are described, Allium taxonomy is in its infancy.  The analogy drawn by Hooker 20 years later to A. narcissiflorum is based upon the days when relatively little was know about Allium taxonomy, as the two species are completely unrelated. In the same Hooker description, he mentions that A. loratum is also near A. atropurpureum except much shorter and with paler flowers... certainly naive comparisons by today's standards... but then again, Hooker largely replicates the original Allium loratum description by Baker of a dwarf alpine species with white flowers.  The original Baker description compares Allium loratum to Allium akaka (syn. A. latifolium) and A. colchicifolium, again somewhat naive in terms of today's taxonomy, but actually somewhat closer in comparing dwarf Allium species having wider (rather than thin thready) leaves.

Now to the next one, Allium “auctum”:
Wietse writes: Allium auctum was found by us on Crete. We always called it a pink form of Allium nigrum, but were told that it might be Allium auctum and since we put that name to it.
We do have Allium cyrillii as well and in my eyes best compared with a longer/bigger form of Allium senescens, (of which we have about 20 different types).

According to The Plant list, Allium auctum Omelczuk is a synonym of Allium cyrilli Ten.  Flora Europaea places A. auctum Omelczuk as "from Krym, with pinkish-violet perianth, is doubtfully distinct from [Allium nigrum]".  Now consider, that Allium nigrum, particularly in the pink forms, comes close to Allium cyrillii.  The name Allium "auctum" is NOT an accepted name, and is either a synonym for A. cyrillii (true) or A. nigrum.

Plants labeled as A. cyrillii in cultivation are 99% or 100% replaced by Allium senescens.  This fact makes perfect sense when I read the statement "We do have Allium cyrillii as well and in my eyes best compared with a longer/bigger form of Allium senescens".  Allium cyrillii is a bulbous species of section Melanocrommyum, closely allied to A. nigrum... one of the few European Melanocrommyum Allium species, whereas Allium senescens is a rhizomatous species that is completely unlike Allium cyrillii.  By the way, if one grows about 100 Allium "species" from the seed exchanges, 30 will end up being Allium senescens, 20 will be either A. cernuum, cyathophorum var. farreri, or schoenoprasum, another 20 will be misidentified as some other species, and only the remaining 30 percent will be true to name. Back to A. cyrillii, there are some good photos of this excellent and distinct species on the web from one good source, as well as my own photos that compare well, I'm happy to provide these links.  Most of what one finds online parrots the same misidentifation, showing Allium senescens forms as this species   Pink forms of Allium nigrum are exactly that, pink forms of Allium nigrum!  The name A. "auctum" is invalid, and has always been regarded as such.

[wmel]

Posted by: TheOnionMan

Allium dolichostylum (note spelling), looks very interesting.  Can't vouch for identity, I'd need to see more of the plant, but a most interesting look to the flowers, and pretty color combination too.  Fine bouquets of Allium hyalinum and A. litvinowii.

I post a picture of allium dolichostylum flower and one of the plant / leaf

[TheOnionMan]

I post a picture of allium dolichostylum flower and one of the plant / leaf

Wietse, that's a fine looking allium, the blended two-tone red to white flowers are most attractive.  Does this species set seed for you?  What is the source of your plants?

[wmel]

Wietse, that's a fine looking allium, the blended two-tone red to white flowers are most attractive.  Does this species set seed for you?  What is the source of your plants?

Ii is not a easy allium, it's making seed, but only a few germinate.
allium dolychostilum "bulbs" are a little like allium plummerae but then smaller. When I leave them in the ground al year the get lost bit by bit, so I harvest them in the summer and store them hot and dry until planting again in oktober, That way the survive but don't make many new "bulbs".

[wmel]

What is the source of your plants?

sorry, I forgot. I bought this allium from Janis Ruksans in 2005 (see his catalog)

[Lvandelft]

The photo showing Allium caroliniaum is misidentified, A. carolinianum has narrow cupped flowers that barely open (almost "pinched") with the long protruding stamens just squeezing by the closed florets, thus having a very different look.  Without seeing the foliage and bulbs I can't say for sure what it is, but definitely not A. carolinianum.

Wietse’s answer at Allium carolinianum:
Allium carolinianum is offered in the trade by several companies, but I was told several times that it probably is not A. carolinianum. Until I don’t know what it is I keep this name for my plants.
An Allium which flowers resemble very much my plants is Allium stellatum.
The difference between the two Allium is the color of the bulbs. Our A. carolinianum has white bulbs and A. stellatum (origin J. Ruksans) has pinkish/red bulbs.

Actually, it is Sir J.D. Hooker that adds English commentary to the Allium loratum entry in Flora of India in 1894, not Baker;

Yes, I understand but....

I think it is o.k. showing here the scans from The Journal of Botany, British and Foreign, article entitled "On the Alliums of India, China, and Japan", by J.G. Baker, Vol.III page 290, published 1874

and of The Flora of British India by Sir J.D. Hooker, Vol. VI. Orchideae to Cyperaceae, published in 1894
 (where you may see what I did read and wrote in my comment)
Nothing wrong with my eyes 

[Lvandelft]

Here are at last some pictures of this week.
Making pictures at the Show is no problem. But for naming and resizing I need lots of time which I hardly had these days
I hope you'll enjoy them though.

Paeonia Cora Stubbs                                 
Paeonia Coral Sunset                                   
Paeonia Mandaleen                                     
Paeonia Vivid Rose

[Lvandelft]

Lilium martagon hybr. Claude Stride                   
Allium Eros
Muscari massayanum                                   
Oxalis lasiandra                                 
Ixia Jesse 
 

[Lvandelft]

and some of the special entries for the Iris competition.
The variation and colors are still improving.
Iris hollandica   
Iris holl. Autumn Princess cl                         
Iris holl. Autumn Princess                         
Iris holl. Cappuchino                                 
Iris holl. Cream Beauty                               
Iris holl. Golden Eagle                             
Iris holl. Pink Panther                             
Iris holl. Silvery Beauty                     
Iris holl. Sky Beauty     

[Ezeiza]

Thanks Luit, once more.

It is interesting to see the Mexican Oxalis lasiandra. Sadly, all the stuff in cultivation seems to be virused.

[Maggi Young]

As usual the selection is both diverse and exciting, Luit.
The red Ixia is elegant and the Muscari rather strange... I like them both. And as for that P. 'Vivid Rose..... just the prettiest colour!

The Iris fans will be lusting after the ose colours, too. They just don't like my garden, though they grow in other s around here. 

[annew]

The coral coloured paeony is a beautiful colour - I can just imagine it with nepeta in the garden.

[Lesley Cox]

Just when you think you know someone, they surprise you  

I try not to disappoint.

[Lvandelft]

This week I suddenly have been locked out of the forum for several days and did not have
any access to the SRGC Web Site.
I planned to send in some pictures of the Show on Thursday but that was not possible.
Now at last I found sometime to do so and hope you'll enjoy them though.

There was a collection of some older and some very new cultivars of Triteleia:

Triteleia Allure                           
Triteleia Rudy                       
Triteleia Corinna                           
Triteleia hyacinthina                     
Triteleia Ocean Queen                           

Triteleia Pink Heaven                       
Triteleia Chrystal Pink                       
Triteleia Power Point