allium 2015

[johnw]

How bizarre the bulbs of Allium lineare as grown by Ken.  They look more like bits of bark or wood than bulbs.

johnw - +12c

[Michael J Campbell]

Allium virgunclae


edit - a typo above - name is  Allium virgunculae Maek. & Kitam.

[fermi de Sousa]

That's a very nice one, Michael.
How tall does it grow?
cheers
fermi

[YT]

Another Allium virgunculae ‘Hirado-Komachi’ in a pot.

[fermi de Sousa]

Allium flavum ssp tauricum,  the yellow type in the garden and a mixed lot still in the seed-pot!
cheers
fermi

[Robert]

Fermi,

Your Alliums certainly look good considering the 40 C heat. A. flavum in its various forms does well here despite the summer heat. We do not get 40 C very often in June, your December. It appears that your summer temperatures are a bit warmer than ours. The Sacramento Valley is the hot spot around here, especially the northern end of the Valley. Our Sacramento Valley bungalow is near the river and the delta where the cooling ocean breezes tend to keep temperatures down.

Are you growing any of our California native Alliums? Many of them endure brutal summer heat and drought.

[Mini bulb lover]

I love the blue Alliums. I have trouble getting good (or any) flowers from A. caeruleum but this A. sikkimense does alright (although it looks like it was partly eaten by something). There's a big difference between the temperature here (39 - 41 C the last 4 consecutive days) and Central Asia! This was taken before the extreme heat. Not the clearest of photos - it's been too windy every time I try to take a photo.

Mark - that Allium callimischon haemostictum is beautiful.

Can someone advise me if it's worth keeping and sowing seeds from Allium stipitatum "Mount Everest"? As it's a hybrid what type of progeny will it produce (if self pollinated)? Most Allium bulbs are expensive here (not that too many are even commercially available) so I'd like to build up some stock from my own seed of the larger and drumstick Alliums.

[Robert]

Jon,

I do not have much experience growing many of the ornamental Alliums, however as a farmer I have plenty of experience growing and saving seed of regular eating Alliums (Onions and leeks, etc.).

The standard Alliums bought at a super market generally suffer terribly from inbred depression, especially if selfed! Even when breeding or creating hybrid onions, using inbreeding techniques, 3-5 plants are grown together with a lettuce bag over the flowering heads to create inbred lines.

I have no idea how it works with the ornamental species. Maybe male sterile lines are also used to create hybrid seed varieties. I just do not know how it is done with the ornamental types. Maybe someone can enlighten me as to their susceptibility to inbred depression and their breeding characteristics (or maybe these are trade secretes?).

[Mini bulb lover]

Thanks Robert for your response. I must admit I don't know too much about inbred depression. I'm glad you brought it to my attention.

Just out of interest, would you still classify 3 - 4  allium flowers cross pollinated with one another that have all originated from the same bulb (via bubils or bulblets) as "selfed", since they're clones of the original bulb?

[Robert]

Thanks Robert for your response. I must admit I don't know too much about inbred depression. I'm glad you brought it to my attention.

Just out of interest, would you still classify 3 - 4  allium flowers cross pollinated with one another that have all originated from the same bulb (via bubils or bulblets) as "selfed", since they're clones of the original bulb?

Jon,

If the plants are all the same clone, then absolutely yes they are selfed.

I have very little experience with the ornamental Alliums, however as I start to work with them I will definitely be out breeding them to maintain the species and with the largest population I can get away with. I generally consider inbreeding as a breeding tool and not a method of maintaining a species (or variety) from seed. I understand that inbreeders, such as modern non-hybrid tomatoes, can be maintained by selfing generation after generation (I do this). However, my experience has been that when I out breed to parallel varietal lines I end up with a much stronger plants and still maintain an acceptable degree of uniformity.

By the way, you might get interesting results from selfing an F1 hybrid. Personally I would grow them on and see what you get. Depending on what type of F1 hybrid it is, there may be very little inbred depression - fatals, detrimentals  expressing themselves. It is very likely you will get a wide variety of different phenotypes. You will never know if you never try. 

Good luck with everything. I sounds fun and interesting to me.