Tropaeolum

[Michael]

Wow, Michael, the photo is scary, reminding me of the sight of areas in southern france covered with Ipomoea indica !
Well, at least you can have nasturium flowers in your salad every day :-)

We also have that Ipomoea growing here. Its interesting t notice that tropaeolum seems to like flat ground and that ipomoea prefers walls and cliffs. I guess in a few million of years there will be an endemic trop and ipo from Madeira
Then the family Tropaeolaceae will not be exclusive from South America anymore 

Jean, i presume T. peltophorum is grown the same way as T. majus?

[Jean-Patrick AGIER]

Wow, Michael, the photo is scary, reminding me of the sight of areas in southern france covered with Ipomoea indica !
Well, at least you can have nasturium flowers in your salad every day :-)

We also have that Ipomoea growing here. Its interesting t notice that tropaeolum seems to like flat ground and that ipomoea prefers walls and cliffs. I guess in a few million of years there will be an endemic trop and ipo from Madeira
Then the family Tropaeolaceae will not be exclusive from South America anymore 

Jean, i presume T. peltophorum is grown the same way as T. majus?

Yes, Tropaeolum Peltophorum as an annual follows the same seasonnal growth. But be aware of the fact that it's germination is probably more difficult. It would be advisable to sow it early in the season if you own a greenhouse and add the traditional nasturtium sowing in May / June when the weather becomes adequate.
Be careful if ordering this species ( I've tried the one listed by Chiltern Seeds a few years ago but  it was not true to species ). I don't know of a reliable seed source at present.

Regards
Jean-Patrick

[Lesley Cox]

Thank you Jean-Patrick. I see that Chiltern DOES list Empress of India and it sounds reasonably true, though I would have emphasized the very dark leaves. But they also have a couple of other very interesting-sounding forms. I'll send them an order.

[Jean-Patrick AGIER]

Hello,
Here are some nice photos of Tropaeolum Peltophorum taken in the greenhouse of the BG of LYON last year showing how variable the flowers could be...

[Jean-Patrick AGIER]

Hello,
Apart from uncommon tropaeolum species, I'm also interested in the double flowered forms of Tr majus.
I've purchased Tr Hermine Grashoff, Margaret Long & Darjeeling Gold. But I've also heard of Tr Apricot Twist but the colour of the flowers seem to be very close to those of Margaret Long. Is it a different species? Does anyone can give more information?
Many thanks
Jean-Patrick

[Ezeiza]

Jean-Patrick:

                   For the sanity of your mind and having your important task of establishing a National Collection, be cautious with the material you are adding to your holdings. There are forms of Troapeolum majus that can pass virus on IN THE SEED. They are sold as "marbled" forms and it seems the public like the "pretty markings". Viruses in Tropaeolum are very powerful, like the ones known to affect aroids like Xanthosoma, Zantedeschia, with serious distortion and defroming of the foliage.

                   A routine aphid control program is necessary.


best

[Jean-Patrick AGIER]

Hi Alberto,
Thanks for your warnings about Tr Majus. I want to gather as many species as I can BUT excluding the Tr Majus hybrids. It would be quite impossible to do when thinking of the number of clones available. And I'll be satisfied with a little more than 80 species ( sometimes with hybrid forms ) to find  . The double flowered forms I've listed in my previous post are all sterile and only reproduced by cuttings. And they are so nice... But I suppose there might also be a slight risk of viruses in all the other rare annuals ?
Regards
Jean-Patrick

[mickeymuc]

Hi there,

Today I noticed the first open flower in T. argentinum - at first I was not even sure if what I see was all of the flower, but it seems that's it - small but I still like it :-)

[ashley]

Magnificent 'eyebrows'

Fine pic Michael.  Is this a small species? 

[mickeymuc]

Hi Ashley,

I grow it the first year, but I think it will be a large one, even in a small pot the leaves are about 5 cm wide, resembling those of T. peregrinum. At the moment the plant is about 60 cm high, but as it is summer growing I expect it to get a lot higher within the next months.
I'll keep you updated :-)

Kind regards,

Michael

[Steven McFarlane]

Hi there

I thought that I would add a couple of comments on some recent posts.  Firstly on T. lepidum and T. hookerianum austropurpureum. A few years ago I grew both of these from seed (the first from Plant World Seeds and the second from J. Watson). They both flowered at the same time and were identical. I have enclosed a photo of what I now just call T. hookerianum austropurpureum which is flowering in my greenhouse at present.

Secondly with regard to T. x tenuirostre. This is, as you would expect, variable. I have two versions. I have included pictures of T. brachyceras, T. tricolor (correct name as in monograph) and one version of T. x tenuirostre. All are in flower at present.

I am continuing to grow an increasing number of species and would hope to post more pictures over the next few months.

[ashley]

I thought that I would add a couple of comments on some recent posts.  Firstly on T. lepidum and T. hookerianum austropurpureum. A few years ago I grew both of these from seed (the first from Plant World Seeds and the second from J. Watson). They both flowered at the same time and were identical. I have enclosed a photo of what I now just call T. hookerianum austropurpureum which is flowering in my greenhouse at present.

Very interesting Steven.  Both are listed on The International Plant Names Index & Kew's ePic.  Do you think they're synonyms or that the Plant World material is wrong? 

Here lepidum is considered a synonym of azureum and earlier in this thread when listed the species he grows Jean-Patrick included lepidum in inverted commas.  Maybe you can explain Jean-Patrick?

[Jean-Patrick AGIER]

Hi everybody,
I'm really not an expert in tropaeolum ( but few of us are... ). I've grown Tr. "lepidum" from Plant world seeds and in fact it seems to be the same plant as Tr. hookerianum ssp austropurpureum. I've grown the latter only from seeds ( JJA, SRGC & AGS exchanges ). This year I've got flowers from the 2 species. Clearly no big difference BUT I noticed some variation in the spur of the flowers.
I think we can't be sure of what we are growing with some species ( Tr brachyceras, Tr beuthii ). I've put lepidum in commas because I still don't know whether it's a true species or not. Having a look in SPARRE's monography I find NO clear description of the plant referred to as Tr lepidum (except that it's considered a variation of Tr azureum ). The seeds offered by Plant World may well be something different.  There's no identification problem with Tr tricolor, Tr pentaphyllum, for example.
Considering Tr brachyceras, everything gets difficult: you may have a look at different pictures which will show different plants. Richard CLIFTON ( of the geraniaceae group ) wrote about this and emphasized the fact that the flowers of this species have SHORT spurs ( as shown in SPARRE's monography ). I personnally purchased 2 tubers from 2 different sources and none of them matched the taxonomic description. So I'm still looking for the REAL Tr brachyceras. Adding to this that Tr brachyceras may hybridize with other species ( Tr beuthii or Tr tricolor as Steven Mc FARLANE explained about Tr X tenuirostre )  and it might be a challenge naming the plants correctly.
I'll put some photos later on.
Regards
Jean-Patrick

[ashley]

Many thanks for those comments Jean-Patrick.   

[Steven McFarlane]

Hello again

There is no doubt that identifying Trops. can be a real challenge. My original plants of T. hookerianum austropurpureum were grown from J. Watson's wild collected seeds but I have no idea about the Plant World Seeds material.  As to T. beuthii, I also originally grew this from wild collected seed and I have always considered it a more attractive species than T. brachyceras having larger and much more open flowers.  I have included a photo I took a few years ago as in the cold west of Scotland many of my plants have still to flower this year.

Tropaeolum beuthii

If you want a further puzzle try this one. Last year I became aware of two plants both being desribed as T. smithii.  The first was from seed collected by Michael Wickenden in South America.  Michael is the owner of Cally Gardens Nursery in south west Scotland. In Cally it grew well outdoors in the summer and rampantly in a greenhouse right through the winter.  The picture is from my only plant.

Tropaeolum smithii Cally

The second plant was from Gary Fisher of Cotswald Garden Flowers and came from a source in Germany.  Gary gave me a few seedlings of which one survived, flowered and produced a few seeds. I have included a picture.  Sadly this plant did not survive the winter and none of the seeds have as yet appeared above ground.  Gary no longer has any of "his" smithii but thinks that this plant is the one listed by Chiltern Seeds.

Tropaeolum smithii CGF

Finally, for now, I thought you might be interested in a sad story.  Many years ago I purchased seed of T. nubigenum from J. Watson. It grew year after year but never produced a flower. Last year it flowered but produced no seed and, you've guessed, died.  I have included a picture as my only surviving memory.

Tropaeolum nubigenum