Galanthus March 2008

[KentGardener]

Bad things always come in threes......

and to finish my set.....

.....here is Baxendales Late from the same order 



from

a thoroughly miserable John

[Martin Baxendale]

On the subject of virus transmission, of course a grower can easily infect loads of stock when chipping if every precaution isn't taken. On occasions I've heard growers describe how they chip and have mentally identified to myself various ways in which they might be passing on virus from one set of chipped bulbs to the next. But often they've been surrounded by people wanting to talk to them so it's difficult to have a quiet chat.

Sometimes the instructions given for chipping leave open the possibility for cross-infection. For example, you'll often read something like "soak chipped bulbs in fungicide solution" without any warning to use a separate container of fungicide solution for each batch of chips, discarding after each batch and washing out the container thoroughly, or "seive chips" out of the solution without warning to wash the sieve thouroughly between batches. I never know if the writer is taking these precautions and forgot to say, or isnt.

[KentGardener]

For example, you'll often read something like "soak chipped bulbs in fungicide solution" without any warning to use a separate container of fungicide solution for each batch of chips, discarding after each batch and washing out the container thoroughly

I have always wondered about this when reading descriptions on chipping.  I now realise, after speaking to others this year, that one mixes up a large amount of fungicide and then decants a little into a separate small container for each chipped bulb.  If I had tried chipping last year I think I would have been reusing one large jug and putting all chipped bulbs into the same container.  It hadn't even occured to me about the sieve!

thanks Martin

John

[Anthony Darby]

Name and shame John. There is no excuse for sending out virussed stock.

Talking of 'Baxendale's Late'. Mine has either kicked the bucket or it is very late this year?

[Martin Baxendale]

My North Green snowdrops just arrived. I got everything except Gal. elwesii 'Naughton', which is a pity as that and 'Yvonne Hay' (which I did get) were the two I especially wanted to try in my breeding programme. Oh well, at least I did get Yvonne Hay.

Only one plicatus type in my order (a couple of Washfield Warham ordered for someone else) so I doubt I'll have any major virus problems (Washfield Warham I find is usually clean, and the elwesii types which make up the bulk of my order don't tend to show virus symptoms and are probably more resistant than plicatus types - also apparently more reistant to fungal disease - one reason I want to use big elwesii cultivars in my  breeding).

[Maggi Young]

The risk is of course the possibility of cross-infection.

EXACTLY! WHY WOULD YOU RISK THE HEALTH OF OTHER PLANTS FOR THE SAKE OF A DUFF SNOWDROP??
This isn't white fever, it is white LUNACY!

I believe there is an old chinese saying   "Beware what you set your heart on for you shall surely have it."

I always said  a thousand million old Chinese were unlikely to be wrong 

[Brian Ellis]

Talking of 'Baxendale's Late'. Mine has either kicked the bucket or it is very late this year?

Fingers crossed Anthony, I thought I had lost mine but it made an appearance last week, and as you are that further to the North I should imagine it may still have time to make an appearance

[Martin Baxendale]

And yet lots of people do keep growing virus-infected snowdrops, Maggi. Reluctance to get rid of something you've paid a lot for or a nice clump that still grows and flowers well.

Some snowdrop viruses don't seem to spread fast (unless helped by the grower) and often snowdrops will live with them and flower normally if well grown, only fading away slowly.

The long-term answer is of course NEW SEEDLING CULTIVARS. Watch this space!   

[Maggi Young]

Martin, I just don't believe that is a sensible idea...... if your old cat were dying of a disease that would take a long time to kill her, would you still allow her to suffer? What if she were infectious to every other cat in the house just by being there ? It just does not make sense.  We have been through the heartache of burning a really fabulous Iris collection because of the arrival of virus in one or two plants.... these are plants, not people; there is no vaccine or quarantine procedure to disinfect them....they could be lethal to your other plants, even if that takes a long time to show up. Viruses transmute, it's what they do... it's in their job description.

Martin is correct, new seedlings are the answer.... and lots of fun to work on...
Snowdrop lovers: I implore you, BREED NEW CULTIVARS and get off the manic bandwagon that has you enthralled.

[mark smyth]

Roll on the day when an infected cat will potentilly infect and kill all all others in the area. When you find one let me know 

[Martin Baxendale]

Maggi, I'm not advocating keeping virused snowdrops in the garden. Just saying that a lot of people do, which is a problem. Just as I'm not advocating people selling virused snowdrops, but some obviously do. I was just pointing out the reasons why some growers keep virused snowdrops - you don't get the flower colour breaking that disfigures things like iris and crocus (well, sometimes a little breaking of the green mark, buit the flower segments are usually fine - difficult to get colour breaking in a white flower) so, if the bulbs are growing okay and flowering people often put up with the virus, trying to keep them away from healthier bulbs. I guess that's okay if you've acres of woodland to sequester them away in, but dogey in a small garden.

I agree - new cultivars. I'm trying, honest. But it's slow work.

[Maggi Young]

Mark: as I wrote that about cats, I  have to admit that bad thoughts WERE going through my mind 

Martin, I know you  were not ADVOCATING the practice, merely documenting it!

[art600]

Maggi

Shame on you 

[Martin Baxendale]

Maybe we all need to have a "virus corner" well away from healthier stock for such snowdrops, if we can't all bear to chuck them out. If you give them good compost and feed well the they can grow and flower okay. The risk is of course the possibility of cross-infection.

Maggi, I suppose (re-reading it) this does sound a bit like advocating keeping them. I was being a little fascetious about the prevalance of virused snowdrops in people's collections and at the same time trying to say that if growers won't chuck them out then at least isolate them (and feed them well, so that at least you'll get good flowers in exhange for the risk of virus spread). The problem is, it can be difficult to see much wrong with virused snowdrops, apart from a few streaks on the leaves, so it can be difficult to persuade growers to chuck them out - even the books say things like virus-like symptoms may just be problems with growing conditions and to try growing them better to see if the symptoms go away!!! I think there's a lot of wishful thinking goes on - blind eye to the telescope "I see no virus" sort of thing.

[Maggi Young]

Maggi

Shame on you   

Mea culpa, Arthur.     In my defence, I can only say I am just VERY fond of our garden birds