Campanula zoysii

[Lawrence]

Can anyone tell me if Campanula zoysii has now been reclassified as Favratia zoysii?

[Maggi Young]

Seems to be, according to the Kew Plant list .. http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl1.1/record/kew-366731
 I defer to Diane Clement on such matters as a rule - she is one smart cookie - so if she says so, I go with that.....

[GordonT]

It is listed on the IUCN Redlist,  theplantlist and hortipedia now as a synonym for Favratia. It seems that it is now in the monotypic genus Favratia. Here is another page that seems to hint that not everyone accepts the revision https://species.wikimedia.org/wiki/Favratia

[Karaba]

The genus Favratia is really not supported by the molecular studies. See for example https://bib.irb.hr/datoteka/253699.Park_et_alpdf or https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Kyeong-Sik_Cheon/publication/259553486_Phylogeny_of_Hanabusaya_(Campanulaceae)_a_Korean_endemic_based_on_ITS_sequences_of_nuclear_ribosomal_DNA/links/54ced31f0cf29ca810fcea83.pdf

The revision of campanulaceae of the plantlist is quite old nw (1999)

[fermi de Sousa]

You'd feel a bit miffed if you got "NAS"'d for entering it in a section for Campanula at a Show!
 
cheers
fermi

[Gabriela]

The Plant list is many times left behind new publications and not reliable as the only source for name changes. The Italians also kept is as C. zoysii.
http://www.actaplantarum.org/flora/flora_info.php?id=1549&pid=-1&p=1

For unresolved/in revision case the name to use can be a personal choice; when in doubt you can write the species with both: name, followed by (the most) accepted synonim.

[Lawrence]

You'd feel a bit miffed if you got "NAS"'d for entering it in a section for Campanula at a Show!
 
cheers
fermi

I know Fermi very miffed!!!! Hence the question really

[Dionysia]

When the same scenario occurred with Trachelium/Campanula asperuloides both were accepted for a while at, least for AGS shows. This changed when the 2013 AGS Exhibitor's Newsletter expressly stated that plants would no longer be accepted in Campanula classes.
Despite this some were and although incorrect labeling does not in itself lead to an NAS, if they are no longer eligible for the specific class entered, it does. As Fermi says this is really only an issue with Campanula and Campanulaceae excluding Campanula classes. However it does show a lack of attention to detail when the correct name has been specifically brought to the attention of exhibitors. Although a recent AGS article by Robert Rolfe stated that Campanula zoysii has now been transferred to Favratia there has been no specific warning to exhibitors so I feel both would be accepted at the moment. I think this situation would be specific to AGS shows as SRGC exhibitors could not be deemed to have read an AGS Exhibitor's Newsletter unless they were also an AGS exhibitor.

[Karaba]

the Campanula phylogeny is such a mess that they shouldn't be so strict with including or excluding some species from the Campanula classes.
The genus Campanula is really not monophylletic, many many genus are still included in the campanula tree. Exluding Trachelium from Campanula or accepting Fravratia would lead to restrict the true campanula to few species. Beeing too laxed with the definition of campanula genus would lead to merge some well know genus (Legousia, Phyteuma, Adenophora... ) in Campanula...
Have a look at these phylogenic trees : http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal.pone.0050076

[Dionysia]

Whilst this may well be true it is only one of many occasions where species switch genera. Very few exhibitors are botanists and we are guided/instructed by show directors and committees as to what is their interpretation of recent developments so as not to make the whole thing unworkable.

[Martin Sheader]

And, for show purposes, in which class would you bench Brian Burrow's Cantata - a C. pulla x C. zoysii hybrid?

[Martinr]

My own personal opinion is that C zoysii will still be a Campanula at AGS shows for the time being, never does to be too hasty with these taxonomic pronouncements! Unless of course those with greater knowledge persuade me otherwise.

Martin, unless I'm being dumb a Campanula x Campanula is still a Campanula but would not be eligible in a class which specifies species only or a geographic class, unless of course it is a natural hybrid.

I'll probably regret dipping my toe in this water

[Dionysia]

Yes Martin R but if zoysii is regarded as Favratia then Cantata becomes a bigeneric hybrid and as such wouldn't be eligible for Campanula or Campanulaceae excluding Campanula classes (because of the pulla side). Are you of the opinion that either name is acceptable in the short term or just Campanula?

[Martinr]

My opinion is that, for the moment, it is still Campanula which gets rid of all the other complications and allows my head to stay firmly buried in the bucket of sand for at least a year

[Dionysia]

That's essentially all that is necessary. A lot of switches are subject to different opinions even among botanists. All we need are the judgments of those in positions of authority to which we may adhere.