seeking ID for these unknown boraginaceae

[ChrisB]

I have two distinctly different plants growing. The one with multiple flowers I think may be Eritrichium canum, but the other one with one rosette of flowers just at the top of the stem looks different.  Flowers are slightly darker blue too, but that’s probably not an identifier anyway.  Can anyone tell me what they both are?  May put some seed in the exchange if I can figure them both out properly, otherwise will just let them self seed around as I find them both very attractive,

[fermi de Sousa]

Hi Chris,
to me the first looks like Cynoglossum (C. amabile?) and the second looks like an Anchusa
cheers
fermi

[ChrisB]

I think you are right Fermi, thanks for that. Thought the second one looked borage like, and I’ve has cynoglossum in the seed ex before.  Can’t remember ever ordering anchusa though.  Maybe it arrived all by itself!  Thanks again!

[Vincent]

Hi Chris and Fermi,
I agree that the first looks like Cynoglossum amabile - an annual species that I like very much. The second looks a lot like a plant in my garden which I bought as Lindelofia longiflora (or grandiflora). Not sure if that one is named correctly though, it looks very much like a Cynoglossum.
Cheers Vincent

[ChrisB]

The seeds the second one produces have tiny hooks on them, like sticky buds but much much smaller.

[Maggi Young]

This may help ....  photo pf Cynoglossum officionale seed   
 By Steve Hurst, USDA NRCS PLANTS Database, Bugwood.org from this site vis  CC permission  :
  https://www.invasive.org/browse/detail.cfm?imgnum=5307026




There are three type of eritrichium seed pictured in our  Seeds to Scale project .... E. aretioides, camtschaticum and  sachalinense

[ChrisB]

Thanks Maggi.  When they ripen I’ll take pics and put them here.  That photo from Steve Hurst is amazing!

[Gabriela]

Cynoglossum is notoriously given/sold as Anchusa (I also bought Anchusa seeds one time which proved to be Cynoglossum).

The seeds are very different and it would be easy to distinguish them. I should have a picture with Anchusa seeds somewhere to post it later (they don't present 'hooks').

[Maggi Young]

From our Seeds to Scale  project ....


Anchusa azurea seed

[Gabriela]

Nice to have a microscope handy for taking seeds pictures.
Mine doesn't have that much detail and I'm not sure about the species, most probably A. officinalis. Just collected few seeds last year for myself and then forgot to sow them.

[ChrisB]

This is really interesting.  Can’t wait now to compare the seeds!

[ChrisB]

Maggi, is there any chance this can be renamed something else. Clearly I made a mistake calling it eritrichium!

[Maggi Young]

 renaming the thread to reflect unknown boraginaceae.

[ashley]

Sorry I can't help with your Boraginaceae Chris, but does your Salvia discolor ever set seed?

[ChrisB]

  I’ll take a look.  My other salvias do, Ashley...

Thanks, Maggi, much more appropriate!