Paeonia 2019

[Catwheazle]

should be Paeonia emodii

Greetings
Bernd

[Gail]

I'm afraid that I tend to be a fence-sitter and am reluctant to try and pin a name on something from cultivated plants. My own plant came from seed from the AGS exchange that was labelled P. wittmanniana which it clearly isn't;


Just to add to the confusion, this paper from the American Journal of Botany which looks at DNA evidence, suggests that P. anomala is a wild hybrid that originated from a cross between P. veitchii and P. lactiflora...
https://bsapubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/pdf/10.3732/ajb.94.3.400

[David Nicholson]

David, I sent you a PM.

Sorry I didn't respond earlier Ashley and thanks for your PM. We spent the last couple of days at Wisley and have just got back home.

[Leena]

Gail, very interesting paper.
P.anomala and P.veitchii seem to be very difficult to tell apart, and I think there are also a lot of hybrids of those two.
I can't say for sure if my own plants which are grown from garden collected seeds are true, many seem to be in between those two.
I have P.anomala which is second generation from wild collected seeds and it does have only one flower per stem, it is very tall and vigorous plant just starting to flower. I have P.veitchii seedlings grown from wild collected seeds, but they haven't flowered yet, and I'm looking forward to see how they are when they mature. My garden-origin P.veitchii plants are very nice not so tall plants, some have 2-3 flowers per stem, but some only 1-2, but I can't say for sure if they are true or hybrids.

P.obovata has now flowered, it was only a short time this year, because the weather was over 25C.
First time flowered also a plant I had grown from seeds of P.japonica (from botanical garden), but I don't know if it is true and how if differs from P.obovata var alba?? It is a very nice plant though.

[Gail]

Your japonica looks very like the form sold by Paul Christian;
https://www.rareplants.co.uk/product/paeonia-japonica/

There were some observations on this group in a recent HPS Peony Group newsletter;
http://www.hardy-plant.org.uk/docs/specialists/Peony-nl-Oct-15.pdf.

Currently just going over in my garden is the hybrid 'Avant Garde' - a Lemoine Hybrid from 1907 resulting from a cross between a P. lactiflora and P. wittmanniana.

[Leena]

'Avant Garde' is very substancial looking, a fine plant. 
Gail, my P.japonica looks just like Paul Christians same. 
It was very interesting to read the newsletter, thank you! It is so difficult to identify species and subspecies, especially if the plants are grown from seeds. On the other hand I would like to have true species but on the other hand getting a good garden plant (from seeds) is maybe even more important.
First time is flowering this plant, it is grown from seed ex seeds as P.caucasica.
In the second picture there are two older plants grown from seeds. The one in the foreground is grown as P.xchamaelon (these have white flowers with pinkish flares, but I have their sister seedlings with red flowers), and the one in the background with blueish leaves is grown as P.wittmanniana. It has pale yellow flowers and it flowers a bit earlier then my mlokos. They may all be some P.daurica hybrids, I don't know, but very nice garden plants.
In the third picture is now flowering P.x hybrida, which is a natural hybrid between P.tenuifolia and P.anomala. It is a tlla plant, over one meter.
The fourth is P. x smouthii, very similar to P.x hybrida.

[Maggi Young]

An American friend, Patricia Becker - who introduced a  new  snowdrop in a recent issue  of IRG ,   asks about this  paeony....







" Would love your help: I grow a mysterious, herbaceous peony here. Can’t recall when or from where it was purchased. Never seen another.
Here are the particulars:
Semi-double flowers start off a beautiful shade of red,
fading to pink as the flowers age.
Stems are up to 5/8” thick and up to 5’ long.
If uncontained the stems snake around in ess curves.
Any ideas for me? 

[Gail]

Interesting mystery plant - don't know it but some peregrina blood...

Here I have P. peregrina


and an Itoh hybrid 'Sonoma Velvet Ruby'

[Leena]

I agree with Gail that it has P.peregrina blood in it. There are tens of hybrids which have P.peregrina in the parentage, so it is really difficult to say which one it is.  Many of them have flowers just like in the picture, but may have small differences in size, flowering time or colour.
If I wanted to know for sure what it is, I would buy a similar named peony and grow them side by side and compare them then. For instance 'Scarlett O'Hara' would be one candidate (though curved stems don't match, 'Scarlett O'Hara' has very strong stems).
There are so many peonies that finding a name to an unnamed one is very difficult if not impossible. I have one old double white lactiflora, which I have been trying to find out what it is, and one time I thought I got it. I planted the named one beside my unknown but in the end they were not the same. Even though the flowers and flowering time were similar, the spring shoots were different colour, in the other one they were green and in the other red!

[David Nicholson]

Grown from seed Paeonia arietina. Fewer flowers this year than has been normal.

[David Nicholson]

This is one that has been in the garden for around three years but has never flowered until this year. The label has long gone but I think it is possible it was from seed Hans Joschko kindly sent me some years ago now. Could anyone help me with a name please?

[Maggi Young]

Other  plants are included of  course, but  there are many wonderful paeony photos  in this AGS  diary entry  by photographer  Jon Evans  from a  visit to the  garden of  Robin and  Sue  White ....
https://www.alpinegardensociety.net/plants/may-at-blackthorn-nursery/?fbclid=IwAR2Wis84QkaNmOKVEKpgGg9RM3iIgJE9eY_QLY3P7eC6tTQtbqW9h421hu0

[Gail]

Paeonia 'Moonrise' a Saunders hybrid from 1949 with some P. peregrina blood which gives it the earlier flowering and good robust foliage.

[Leena]

Thank you Maggi for the link, there are really nice pictures of peonies there.
I don't know David's peony, can it be some kind of P.mascula?

My big P.anomala has been flowering last week. It is one meter tall and more than one meter wide.
Also some P.daurica peonies are flowering, here are two first time bloomers grown from seed ex seeds 'Aurelia'. The other seedling has red/pink flowers and the other pale cream with red veins.
The last peony is an unknown hybrid, with possibly some daurica blood in it. I have gotten it from a friend who had bought it from Estonia. It seems to be sterile, at least I have never gotten any viable seeds from it. It has bigger and more open flowers than most of my other P.dauricas.

[Gabriela]

The peonies are flowering - and all are beautiful!

Leena - your P. japonica is indeed P. japonica.
I agree with what you say, most important is to get a good garden plant. I understand that many species can cross pollinate anyway.

My peonies grown from seeds are too young to flower yet but I enjoyed the first flower of P. officinalis of a small division I got from a friend