Lilium and allies (Cardiocrinum. Notholirion and Nomocharis) 2008

[johnw]

Do the bulbs of L. souliei look like L. lophophorum? There's another Chinese source offering what I think could be the real thing, but their minimum order is unfortunately quite high.

Arisaema - As I recall the bulb was a dark burgundy colour on arrival with stout curved scales.  I can't say I've paid much attention to my L. lophophorum bulbs to make a comparison. I'd be interested to know the other Chinese source for L. souliei. A shot of the leaves attached.

Leslie - The Amorphophallus is waning so the fragrance of just 2 L. nepalense flowers was delightful filling the yard last night. It was humid and 20c last night and those conditions seem to enhance the effect.  I crossed nepalense with polyphyllum yesterday after seeing the nepalense hybrid in The Garden this month - just maybe; white martagon would make a more sensible cross.

I was surpised Maggi said L. henryi peters out in Scotland. I've had one here for 10-15 years and it always blooms but is indeed slow to spread.

Also L. taliense (?) from AGCBC seed (photos).

Lilium sargentiae from Jens Nielsen seed via Denmark and L. henryi still to come.

johnw



 

[Maggi Young]

I don't recall saying that L. henryi peters out, John... merely that it persists but does not thrive... or increase...

[johnw]

I don't recall saying that L. henryi peters out, John... merely that it persists but does not thrive... or increase...

Seems I fused your remark with Gote's - permissible at my age.

johnw

[gote]

Thank you Arisaema,
I look forward to see them flower. They are among my favourites even if my feelings were not previously reciproced.

I think that the Notholirion is bulbuliferum (previously hyacinthinum) Those I have/had have been more bluish but the flower shape is the same. I find it beautiful and neglected.

I have to apologise for forgetting a feature of Cardiocrinum cathayanum. Giganteum has big whitish bracts that fall off when the flower develops. C. cathayanum is said to have persisting bracts.

Göte

[arisaema]

Thanks for the confirmation, Göte!

John - I've PMed you the source Your L. taliense "var. kaichen" looks lovely, I tried ordering it from Chen Yi once, but she sent L. leichtlinii instead... Would you mind posting a picture of the foliage?

ETA: I've also noticed that what she sends as L. souliei is prone to rot, half of them died in their first year, and none have flowered yet. I've posted an old pic of an L. lophophorum bulb below.

[Jim McKenney]

Your L. taliense "var. kaichen" looks lovely, I tried ordering it from Chen Yi once, but she sent L. leichtlinii instead... Would you mind posting a picture of the foliage?

Arisaema, when you say Lilium leichtlinii, you mean the usual orange-flowered form, don't you? Or do you? Has the yellow-flowered form ever been reported from China?

[arisaema]

Jim - Yes, just the common, orange one unfortunately, var. maximowiczii?

[johnw]

Thanks for the confirmation, Göte!

John - I've PMed you the source Your L. taliense "var. kaichen" looks lovely, I tried ordering it from Chen Yi once, but she sent L. leichtlinii instead... Would you mind posting a picture of the foliage?

ETA: I've also noticed that what she sends as L. souliei is prone to rot, half of them died in their first year, and none have flowered yet. I've posted an old pic of an L. lophophorum bulb below.

Here are a few sloppy pix of the L. taliense  - in a rush as the rain has started and 1.5 inches of rain tonight and the end of a tropical storm Tuesday.  Will self this lily and cross it with nepalense.

johnw

[johnw]

John - I've PMed you the source Your L. taliense "var. kaichen" looks lovely, I tried ordering it from Chen Yi once, but she sent L. leichtlinii instead... Would you mind posting a picture of the foliage?

ETA: I've also noticed that what she sends as L. souliei is prone to rot, half of them died in their first year, and none have flowered yet. I've posted an old pic of an L. lophophorum bulb below.

The souliei (?) looked nothing like thw lophophorum bulb you posted. It was fat and squat the shape of a garlic with thick scales.  I will ask Philip MacDougall if he's had any bloom as he sent it to me.

johnw

[arisaema]

Here are a few sloppy pix of the L. taliense  - in a rush as the rain has started and 1.5 inches of rain tonight and the end of a tropical storm Tuesday.  Will self this lily and cross it with nepalense.

Thank you! I've always wondered if L. taliense and "var. kaichen" differed in any other way that the colour, and it would seem they do, mine has slimmer, darker leaves with papillose edges. I'd be happy to send some pollen if you think it would get there in time, I've had issues with self-incompatibility, only a few good seeds produced each year.

[gote]

I agree re shape of lopophorum bulbs. They are unusually slender as in the photo.
Göte

[gote]

Johnw,
I think that your Lilium polyphyllum may be wrongly named. It is one of the lilies that I have not grown but the literature says that it is closer to monadelphum and perhaps martagon than to the sinomartagon group.
Polyphyllum is described as having more trumpet shaped flowers that are only reflexed halfway down. Since it grows in north India and Afghanistan but not in China we have little help of Haw or Flora of China.
Googling the picture only produces a painting probably from the Elwes monograph, to which I do not have acesss. Your looks more like form of the talinense, xanthellum group.
Göte

[David Nicholson]

Re: Lilium polyphyllum.

In case it is any help here is an extract from 'Lilies' by Edward Austin McRae.

'Native to Himalayas, from Afghanistan through Kashmir to Kumaon, at 1800-3700 meters.
Bulb-long, narrow and white grows 25-60cm deep with very long roots.
Stem-40-120cm tall, sometimes as tall as 240cm, with scattered linear, or narrowly lanceolate leaves.
Generally bears 1-10 flowers but sometimes as many as 40. Fragrant nodding, bell shaped flowers with lower half of tepals strongly rolled under. Colour greenish yellow inside, and cream on outside, prettily spotted with lilac. Pollen is orange/red. Seed round and unwinged. Germination-hypogeal in warm conditions and growth is then delayed through a cold season.
Difficult in cultivation, preferring deep planting and no late transplanting, long roots should be shaded. Recommended conditions include a northern exposure, protection from wind, and half shade. Hardiness seems not to be a problem.

[johnw]

re: L. polyphyllum (not)

Thanks all.  It is not clear from my label if the Taylors had collected this lily  - whatever it is - in the NW Himalayas or if they were simply stating on the seed packet that it was known to occur in that area.  Remember it was originally labelled L. porophyllum.  It would be interesting to find out from the Taylors if they had collected the seed and from where. Anyone see them frequently?

johnw

[rob krejzl]

I think that your Lilium polyphyllum may be wrongly named. It is one of the lilies that I have not grown but the literature says that it is closer to monadelphum and perhaps martagon than to the sinomartagon group.
Polyphyllum is described as having more trumpet shaped flowers that are only reflexed halfway down. Since it grows in north India and Afghanistan but not in China we have little help of Haw or Flora of China.

There is a picture of L. polyphyllum in Phillips & Rix (p. 195 in my book); one of the flowers shown is just opening - it is remarkably similar to the unreflexed picture posted earlier. Mature flowers do indeed seem to resemble monadelphum in their habit.