Crocus November 2008

[Gerry Webster]

Dirk - I can only echo Luc & Armin. The rose pink C. caspius is simply beautiful.

[mark smyth]

The white C. laevigatus is a stunner

[HClase]

The C. medius are almost over now - it's easy to get a clump like that, all you have to do is to put a dozen fat corms into an 11 cm pot!  I'm still amazed how well most species will grow in such a tiny space even though I've been doing it for years.

Crocus tournefortii is a bit earlier for me that usual, and, of course fully open despite the dull weather we've been having lately.  My stock of C. goulimyi has been augmented by three corms from Janis Ruksans supplied as subsp. leucanthus, but, as I hope you can see the middle one of the three is very pale lilac and the other two pure white.  I'm not sure of the taxonomy here as Mathew doesn't mention the paler forms.  Unlike the others in the frame they have grown rather tall in the poor light.  I see one flower coming up outside too in my trial bed, perhaps like the medius they'll do better in the lawn.

I've some old selected C. speciosus hanging on on the rock garden (they seem to be the only plant I know of that isn't smothered by Bolax!) and am not sure of the variety - it may be 'Artibir'.  They are all slug eaten and this is the best specimen could find - any suggestions?

I agree, those white laevigatus are stunning, I wish I could grow more outside.

[Thomas Huber]

I've some old selected C. speciosus hanging on on the rock garden (they seem to be the only plant I know of that isn't smothered by Bolax!) and am not sure of the variety - it may be 'Artibir'.  They are all slug eaten and this is the best specimen could find - any suggestions?

Howard, this plant doesn't look like the form I have as Artabir, but I still can't be sure that my plant is true.
No better suggestion which cultivar your plant is, sorry 

[mark smyth]

Howard I think your Crocus tournefortii is the wrong way round - lying on it's side.

[Anthony Darby]

A rose pink crocus - gosh! If that is a constant feature I think there will be a queue a mile long for offsets from that one!

Edit: refers to pic of rose pink Crocus caspius on previous page...Reply #41 on: November 09, 2008, 04:04:34 PM »

[Gerry Webster]

My stock of C. goulimyi has been augmented by three corms from Janis Ruksans supplied as subsp. leucanthus, but, as I hope you can see the middle one of the three is very pale lilac and the other two pure white.  I'm not sure of the taxonomy here as Mathew doesn't mention the paler forms. 

Howard - there are accounts of C. goulimyi leucanthus in AGS Bulletins vol 61,p316 (which I don't have) & vol 64,p429 (which I do) where it is described as a variety. I don't know when it was elevated to subsp. status nor on what basis.  It is likely that most of the plants grown in the UK come from a Steve Keeble collection made near Monemvasia in 1992. The plants are described as  either white or pale lilac. Plants I have raised from Steve Keeble seed are all white though I have  a  bicoloured plant received as subsp leucanthus. Whether it is I don't know nor do I know how one decides; BM's 1982 update sheds no light on the matter. 
Until you have a number of corms I would be cautious about trying it outside. It doesn't like it here.

[Maggi Young]

Here' what Brian Mathew writes in the AGS bulletin vol 61,p316 :
the article is "A New Crocus Variant" and addresses Crocus goulimyi and its forms.

" During the period when it (refers to C. goulimyi, in Dutch cultivation)was pleantiful, a lovely white form occurred among the ordinary coloured forms in a nursery bed and this was originally propagated and distributed by Michael Hoog. It proved to be just as vigorous as the stock from which it had arisen, although it is stil not a common plant.As far as I know, this has always been dubbed 'Alba', which it what so frequently happens to white forms, but the nomenclatural code does not recommend this approach, preferring names such as 'Bowles White' ( in the case of the albino C. sieberi ). Since this white C. goulimyi is a clone, and an excellent one, I propose the name of C. goulimyi 'ManiWhite'for thisparticular albino variant.
A white version was also recorded in the wild in a population of the normally coloured forms on the Mani peninsula in 1991 by Steve Keeble, and he noted that it looked just like the form in cultivation."

There is an accompanying photo of a large spread of Crocus goulimyi var. leucantha (sic) taken near Monemvasia, SE Greek Peloponnese by Steve Keeble.

[Gerry Webster]

Maggi - thanks for this. I edited my post while you were posting yours.

[Gerry Webster]

Here is the entry in the RBG Kew Monocot Checklist:
Names in bold indicate accepted names, plain list indicates non accepted names.

Crocus goulimyi Turrill, Kew Bull. 10: 59 (1955).

Crocus goulimyi f. albus B.Mathew, Bot. Mag. (Kew Mag.) 1: 73 (1984).

Crocus goulimyi var. goulimyi.

Crocus goulimyi subsp. leucanthus (B.Mathew) B.Mathew, Bot. Chron. 13: 257 (2000).

Crocus goulimyi var. leucanthus B.Mathew, Ann. Mus. Goulandris 9: 168 (1994 publ. 1995).

It would seem that 'leucanthus' has reverted to varietal status.

[ashley]

Thanks Maggi and Gerry.  This forum is such a wonderful source of information

Congrats on your latest award by the way Maggi - although to acknowledge your contribution to the forum half adequately it should have been the key to Willy Wonka's entire establishment   

[tonyg]

How easy it is to err when you don't read the small print ... var and ssp have certainly become confused in my mind where C goulimyi leucanthus is concerned.  I will check my literature when I get home but doubtless Gerry has it right when he goes to Kew!  It looks like I for one have been guilty of perpetuating this mistake.
The RHS Plantfinder lists ssp leucanthus but then it would as this is what is offered by so many. 
Notably JJAseeds (AKA the unimpeachable Jim & Jenny Archibald) offer VAR leucanthus.

[mark smyth]

Maggi you have just made me go and sort my bulletin collection in to date order

[Lvandelft]

I remember that Thomas asked me if I could possibly a field with autumn flowering Crocus.
In my neighbourhood only small quantities are grown but I knew that in the NW. part of Holland it is more likely to find such a field.
But with the Dutch windy and rainy weather in autumn, you have to be very lucky to see such a field in full glory.
This week I saw in the Dutch horticultural journal 'Bloembollenvisie' a recent picture of
a field of about 14000 m² and I made a picture of it.

Crocus speciosus

[Thomas Huber]

  Wow - thanks Luit 
I think it will need some more years until my garden looks like this.