Epimedium - various threads gathered together here

[Lori S.]

Would most of these be hardy in zone 4?
Phillip, how hardy is the Thalictrum diffusiflorum?

Helen, I haven't managed yet to find an epimedium or thalictrum species that is not hardy here in zone 3, so I'd say that all are certainly worth a try.

[Tony Willis]

Tony, I'm curious as to where your E. latisepalum came from. I've never seen the true thing and pics are scarce on the web. Your plant looks like an upright form of what I received from Chen-yi as latisepalum but is probably E. wushanense. Stern describes E. latisepalum as being few flowered, on unbranched flower spikes , occasionally having side shoots with 2 flowers, typically 8 or so flowers on the spike. I'd like to see the ones Darrell sells.

Philip mine came from Chen yi,I bought a selection some years ago. I find Stearn very confusing with minor differences between species and as is probably clear from other threads I am not in agreement with the splitting of vaguely different plants into numerous species.

I also have grown Thalictrum diffusiflorum for a number of years, a beautiful plant. Where it is at the moment I cannot say other than under snow somewhere.

[fleurbleue]

PDJ, I was just ordering eppies and other loving shade from Long Acre Plants and I am happy learning from you it's a good nursery  Maggipie I shall have (perhaps  new eppies seeds next year 

[maggiepie]

Would most of these be hardy in zone 4?
Phillip, how hardy is the Thalictrum diffusiflorum?

Helen, I haven't managed yet to find an epimedium or thalictrum species that is not hardy here in zone 3, so I'd say that all are certainly worth a try.

Thanks Lori, I was hoping you might be around.

Nicole, I wish you the best of luck with your new eppies

[Lesley Cox]

Philip, never worry here about Off Topic. We're all very good at that.

I too, was going to ask about the height of Thalictrum diffusiflorum because in your pictures it looks very like one I had many years ago from the late, great Roy Elliott, just as Thalictrum species. It grew to about 30 or 35 cms and had similar very large flowers. I believe Dave Toole in NZ has it again after many years of its being lost to us. He gave me a small seedling but an animal knocked the whole plant off at pot level and nothing grew away again. There was some thought that it may have been T. orientale.

[Philip MacDougall]

Tony, John and I have also discussed Sterns book. When we read between the lines we think he may have been working with very limited material for his descriptions. And the Chinese are notorious splitters. So I would agree with you that some of the descriptions and the delineation of some of the species has a lot to be desired. With only one or two clones of many of the new species in cultivation it's sometimes no more than guesswork as to where one species ends and another begins. For what it's worth there's an interactive key to the Chinese species in The Flora of China. Philip

[Philip MacDougall]

Lesley, I received the Thalictrum from Margaret Charlton, I think it came to her via Heronswood. I was under the impression that Dan and the Whynn-Jones had done the initial introduction but as the Whynn -Jones don't mention this in their catalog I may be wrong. It's supposed to have the largest flowers in the genus and as it comes from Tibet it has a good chance of being reasonably hardy. About 4 feet tall, a bit lax.  Don't know why it's not in the trade yet, it's stunning and should be easy.

[johnw]

Tony, John and I have also discussed Sterns book. When we read between the lines we think he may have been working with very limited material for his descriptions. And the Chinese are notorious splitters. So I would agree with you that some of the descriptions and the delineation of some of the species has a lot to be desired. With only one or two clones of many of the new species in cultivation it's sometimes no more than guesswork as to where one species ends and another begins. For what it's worth there's an interactive key to the Chinese species in The Flora of China. Philip

Philip  - I think we were discussing the Podophyllum section in Stern.  You know how much I know about Epimedium!  Must say my enthusiasm for them is growing by leaps and bounds thanks to this thread.

johnw

[Lesley Cox]

So much too tall to have been the one I had and I hope Dave still has. I've seed seed of diffusiflorum somewhere, I'm sure. Will have to keep an eye out.

[Tony Willis]

Tony, John and I have also discussed Sterns book. When we read between the lines we think he may have been working with very limited material for his descriptions. And the Chinese are notorious splitters. So I would agree with you that some of the descriptions and the delineation of some of the species has a lot to be desired. With only one or two clones of many of the new species in cultivation it's sometimes no more than guesswork as to where one species ends and another begins. For what it's worth there's an interactive key to the Chinese species in The Flora of China. Philip

Philip  - I think we were discussing the Podophyllum section in Stern.  You know how much I know about Epimedium!  Must say my enthusiasm for them is growing by leaps and bounds thanks to this thread.

johnw

John and I have also discussed the podophyllum sectioon. I must say however many species there are or not they seem to be without exception wonderful plants for the woodland. My woodland is about four square yards.

[TheOnionMan]

Epimedium Hybrid - Posting 1a

Hello Epimedium lovers, I thought I would put together a couple posts to illustrate a hybrid that occured between Epimedium brevicornu and E. membranaceum.  This part of my post will primarily show E. brevicornu, one of the very best eppies in my opinion.  What I like about this species, is the perky upright growth, with sprays of small white and yellow flowers clearly displayed above the foliage.  It also blooms for an exceptionally long time, being among the first to bloom, but also one of the last.  It is a clumper, so no spreading habit to worry about.  And it has lovely red-mottled foliage in spring.

I start with a photo in 2007 showing the upright profile, followed by a series of views taken in 2008 & 2009 as it pushed into bloom.  The next to last photo is an overhead shot, showing Saruma henryi in bloom, just getting a glimpse of E. brevicornu to the right of a boulder, and in the lower right, the foliage and emerging buds of E. membranaceum.

E. membranaceum is on my personal top 10 list; it starts flowering late, has enormous spidery bright yellow flowers with white-pink-spotted sepals.  A low grower (and another clumper), the species is remarkable because it is an ever-bloomer, with low ascending branched stems and sprays of golden spiders, blooms all summer long and into the fall.  As such, it is an excellent candidate for hybridization.  While E. brevicornu started blooming long before E. membranaceum, there is a brief overlap of bloom time; a photo depicts this overlap.  Notice the hirsute stems and seed pods on E. brevicornu in the last photo.

I will follow up later with Posting 1b, with photos of E. membranaceum and the resulting hybrid that flowered for the first time in 2009.

[galahad]

I love it

[Lesley Cox]

A gorgeous thing Mark, especially with those blotched leaves which add to the overall effect. By the way what is that rather hairy, spiky thing in the last picture, looking slightly like deer antlers in velvet?

[TheOnionMan]

A gorgeous thing Mark, especially with those blotched leaves which add to the overall effect. By the way what is that rather hairy, spiky thing in the last picture, looking slightly like deer antlers in velvet?

Oh, sorry about that, I didn't make it clear.  You're seeing two flowers of E. membranaceum (in focus), a couple much smaller flowers of E. brevicornu (out of focus), the "deer antler" is the multibranching inflorescence on E. brevicornu.  Bear this in mind when I show the hybrid seedlings, as the fuzziness on the inflorescence branches can show up in the hybrids.  Notice at the ends of the fuzzy stems there are glabrous seed pods forming.

[Lesley Cox]

Oh. Thanks.

Oh yes, now I see the seeds. I hadn't noticed them before.