Biarum

[Pascal B]

Oops, silly me.....

I quess I was too lazy to search....

[Tony Willis]

Last year we had a brief discussion on identifying biarums using the true flowers as indicated in the monograph key. I put up a picture of a spathe cut open to display the flowers of two species of known origin and in my opinion this proved the key to be quite inconclusive as neither of the specimens fitted.

Lol..., don't let Peter hear about that....
Do you have a link of that discussion?
Too bad the trade sometimes "invents" species which are hard to get rid of once they are on the market and create confusion.

Pascal thanks for your email and I will reply direct and thanks to Maggi for the link to last year which I see Pascal has now looked at and I hope you find it interesting.

I think we must not take discussion to be criticism and clearly in the world of botany as in many others differences of opinion will on many occasions never be reconciled hence the numerous name changes which by implication indicate the previous author was wrong and the latest is correct (until it is changed back or given some other name).My understanding is that this particular plant was originallycollected by Brian Mathew who as we know is very highly regarded and it would be interesting to know who put a name to it.

[Alex]

Posted this elsewhere, but should have been here....B. ditschianum today

[Oron Peri]

Posted this elsewhere, but should have been here....B. ditschianum today

Alex is it in flower now?

[Alex]

It is indeed - my experience with this over the last few years has been that it puts up flowers sporadically any time between late July and mid October.

Alex

[BULBISSIME]

I got flowers 2 month's ago !

[Carlo]

Love that little guy.... Can't wait to find it over here.

[Peter B]

Pascal told me about the Biarum thread running here and suggested I add a few stray thoughts.

The origin of the name ‘ochridense’  is amusing. Brian Mathew showed me MT4629 (indeed Mathew & Tomlinson) flowering at Kew in the late-80s, at a time when the 'end' of Arum was in sight I was just beginning to consider tackling Biarum and Eminium. Rather than treating the various morphs  as subordinate taxa I was at that time mentally splitting Biarum tenuifolium into separate species (my standard approach at the start of a new study - on the basis that it's easier to lump later than untangle later) and since this plant just didn't match 'typical' tenuifolium , and further didn't seem to have an applicable taxonomy, in line with my (and most other botanists) standard technique I assigned it a 'working name' as a means of having a convenient nomenclatural handle to avoid the cumbersome 'tenuifolium from Lake Ochrid' appellation. Somehow or other this working name filtered into the trade and a 'reputable Wrexham-based nurseryman' snapped it up to use in his catalogue.

There is still much to do with tenuifolium, and I am the first to admit that the taxonomy of this part of the genus is by far the weakest in the monograph. However, subtle as the differences are, taken empirically (that is to say morphology+ecology+phytogeography) by and large the taxonomic divisions I proposed DO work most of the time. Regarding zelebori, the stout, club-like spadix appendix that sub-equals the spathe limb is absolutely consistent. Similarly the green terminal portion of the spathe limb in abbreviatum holds true as a reliable character, and while these and other solitary morphologies (e.g., the leaf rosette of idomenaeum are alone not enormously convincing, when combined with the phytogeography of these taxa they seem to hold true.

Regarding flowering time, it is important to remember that these are notoriously plastic, even in the wild, but that the 'general' period does hold true.

[Maggi Young]

Greetings, Phymatarum, it is good to have your contribution. 
Would you care to introduce yourself to the Forumists?

[Pascal B]

Greetings, Phymatarum, it is good to have your contribution. 
Would you care to introduce yourself to the Forumists?

Sorry Maggi, I probably should have mentioned that I was going to ask Peter Boyce, the author of the monograph on Biarum, if he knew where the name Biarum ohridense came from.

[Maggi Young]

Pascal, thank you for this note......I would not have realised that from the "nickname -Phymatarum":  how good it is to have such an "Aroider" as Peter to advise on matters. My thanks to you and to Peter for coming to help out.

[Tony Willis]

Pascal

that is a super explanation from Peter and thank you both for it.My only question is ,is it being placed in tenuifolium and if so which ssp?

My B. ditschianum flowered in early July when we were away and so I have not seen it in the flesh.

[Peter B]

Dear Maggi et allii,

Apologies that my posting was somewhat cloaked - not at all my intention, just the result of the state of what passes for my brain after a day spent ploughing thorough a thesis purportedly written by someone with both knowledge of the English language and ability in natural sciences. All I can say it it would have been nice if they'd removed the hyperlinks for the copy, cut and pasted text...

To more serious matters. Tony: 'ochridense' falls unequivocally into ssp. abbreviatum.

[Maggi Young]

Peter, it's a real pleasure to "meet" you.

Your description of your irksome day was heartfelt and I am sure many can sympathise with such travails, which can exhaust one twice as fast as a day of "hard labour"   
( I was going to say "chopping wood" but while that might be the back-breaking physical task of the moment for many in the rapidly cooling north at this time or year, it is hardly likely to be the case in Malaysia where Peter probably has more need of air conditioning than a roaring fire!)

But back to "more serious matters", as you say...... It is most helpful to have some definitive answers to the ID questions that so vex us with so many plants.

[Tony Willis]

Biarum pyrami from Turkey flowering for the first time for me. The spadix is about 25cms high and the spathe length about the same.