Where are the younger members

[Joakim B]

Being 39 might make me young or at least younger than some. I feel that even though this is a very nice place, I was a bit uneasy in the beginning. This is a specialist society and not for a special type of plant but rather a special way of doing gardening. I have an interest in bulbs, hepatica and iris (though the latter is not obviously something for the club even though it now has a section of its own).
People might grow plants but might take time to develop into a special way of growing and there is an elitism around gardening and garden amateurs (in the old meaning of non professional specialists) that rock gardening is for the most experienced, since it takes a time to fill a garden and after that a rockery helps You grow a lot of different / difficult hard-to-get plants.

Some people has chosen to call that they grow like this to have the growing as close as possible to the natural environment and that approach might be more attractive to younger people.

Growing in troughs might actually be a way to have a nicer garden in a smaller space than what we ourself grew up in. At least here the gardens are getting smaller in the cities than they were when I was a child.

The fact is that here are threads about the common plants as well and the very relaxed attitude on the forum about what plants to show here have made me join the club even though I see myself a gardener/ planter rather than a rock gardener. I do like plants that also grow well in a rockery but most plants are more common and I might have been more at ease in "gardeners are us" or what ever they might be called garden organisation for people that would like to have grass that cuts itself and hedges growing without needing to be cut. They might like nice plants but maybe in the beginning people buy bigger things rather than a small bulb? Later they might buy bulbs as well but often like me the ones in the supermarket with 10 for 1€ or so rather than 1 for 10€. A nice plant in a normal garden society is a common one here so there is sometimes harder to be accepted here than in other forums due to the skill that many has. It takes some time to appreciate the small differences in some plants and the training here on the forum and bulb logs and Wesley logs help teaching the differences and helps to show the detail that open up a new world for us beginners in some new fields. In other fields of gardening we might be more experienced.

If the society can have a relaxed view on what people grow and how so that people might have some common grounds it is easier to joining and later go towards more specialised way of growing. I have seen comments on the Swedish forums that they are not good enough to join some of the Swedish societies since in the old days it was and to some still is elitist. I understand that the goal of growing for shows is to develop growing techniques and plants but might also make people think I like the plants but could not do it myself so these things might be a twigged sword so to say. (or the coin has two sides).
Regarding finding stipends it is not easy to find the right ones when looking and most people go and look where others have found before them rather than trying to find a new one.

Regarding slap on the bum I sometime see it here as well and generally from an older man on a younger man/boy. It can be comments like check in a book that would not have come to a novice in a field with gray hair. I have not got any such response but have seen others getting so I think sometimes there is a reverse ageism. Then again silence might be even worse that a slap. (No comments on pictures or questions).

The forum has gained a lot of members from specialised plant areas like pleone and galathus that might not be typical "first in mind" type of rock plants and there might be other groups that works in a similar way. The alpine part is not the biggest part of the forum (far from it). Is the club also like this or it the club more into alpines/rockgardening with only traditional plants as topics for the talks of the meetings?
I am in no way saying that SRGC should be changing its name and style but maybe think about some of the things like specialist groups / plants.

Sorry for the very long post
Kind regards
Joakim

[Paddy Tobin]

Joakim,

I think you have identified many of the great strengths of the online SRGC. It is a very diverse place with room for beginner and specialist, even cooks.  This range of interests could hardly be accommodated in a traditional club setting but here it is perfectly feasible.

I am not one of the specialist growers. Indeed, I give as much time and gain as much enjoyment from growing vegetables as from growing alpine plants. Trees, shrubs and herbaceous perennials cover most of my garden and I enjoy these very much. Of latter years I have become an accidental holder of a collection of snowdrops, initially a collection passed into  my care by my wife and then added to in extremely generous manner by friends both off and on this forum and so I take a particular interest and enjoyment in the snowdrop.

Regarding "experts" who are unsympathetic to beginners, it is my belief that while they may consider themselves experts they have not in fact gained the experience of years when they would have learned that plants and nature in general makes fools of us all, a little like the saying, "The more I know, the more I know I don't know." - I know enough to  know I don't know everything.

The images below are the first and part of the second page of Reginald Farrer's "My Rock Garden" and display the attitude of an experienced alpine grower. Thankfully, there are many, many such on this forum.

Paddy

[Hristo]

 

[Paddy Tobin]

Chris,

A very thoughtful and thought-provoking contribution to this discussion and I will comment on just a few of your ideas.


I would certainly be happy to receive the twice-yearly journal as a pdf file. It would save the club some money and save me storing a journal I am unlikely to read more than once. There is a stack of AGS journals here which I am unlikely to read again but am slow to throw out. If they were available online it would be sufficient for my needs. Likewise, I am unlikely to attend any SRGC meetings or shows and if both of these led to a reduced membership contribution I would not object at all. However, I have previously been a member of the RHS and the AGS and, in the past year, have allowed both of these memberships to lapse as I found the online SRGC gave me more enjoyment and interaction with fellow gardeners than both of the other societies and, with this in mind, I am more than happy to pay the full membership rate. The SRGC online is, for me, an excellent gardening club. There is no local gardening club here in Waterford with a strong active gardening community (mainly a social club for those even older than I where tea and cakes are more important than gardening). The nearest alpine group is in Dublin, 100 miles away. There is a hardy plant/alpine group in Cork, 80 miles away and Mary and I attend winter talks when possible and I see Ashley who travels a similar distance from the opposite direction there occasionally. The nearest SRGC members are Ashley - about 150 miles away; Michael Campbell - 130 miles away; Mark Smyth - 200 miles away, so Lesley, Paul T, Rogan, Cohan, JohnW, Robin, and my many special and generous snowdrop friends, to name a few, though scattered across the globe are as near to me as my nearest gardening neighbours here in Ireland. The SRGC membership contribution is well worth the benefits it brings. It has brought all these - and many more - wonderful people into my life and I enjoy their company very much.

So, Chris, what you say about web-based activity is so very true and the SRGC is, in my mind, leading the way and showing other societies how it should be done though, to be perfectly honest, I believe the strength is not in the format of the website but in the people who "man" (can't somehow say "woman") the site. The strength of this site is in the people and the very personal and friendly manner in which this site is run. One meets friends here not simply other people who share a common interest. I have received many unsolicited and unannounced gifts of bulbs and seeds in the post from friends on this site. Where else in the world would that happen? Yes, indeed, the SRGC rocks!

Paddy

[Ragged Robin]

Paddy you have a great way of expressing the meaning of this unique Forum, because unique it is in so many ways as you describe. Although there is always room for improvement within an organisation essentially the people are what makes it tick.  Without the friendliness, interest and generosity of people the whole thing is souless.  There are a thousand ways of finding out information on the web if you do the right search but where can you guarantee a question will be answered and followed up within minutes and someone cares enough to do some research into a problem that is not solvable on your own.  Add to the melting pot all the expertise and hints and tips and the Global Moderation to keep the whole machine running in an efficient and worthwhile way and there you have a reason for paying a modest sum for being part of the whole - Membership is commitment 

[Eric Locke]

Just seen this thread.

I am a younger member ( I"m only 58  )

Eric

[Paddy Tobin]

Stand in the corner and stop being such a smart ass, young Locke.

You're an old fogie - I'm only 56, youngest in our local garden club for nearly 30 years.

Paddy

[Hristo]

 

[Maggi Young]

I'm glad you mentioned the work you are doing for the Seed ID project, Chris.... this is a terrific contribution to the work of the Club in this matter  for which we are very grateful.
It is the case that several Forum Members, while not actual SRGC Members , do contribute to the SRGC
( without whose  financial backing this place would not exist) in "kind", so to speak.... they work for the Seed ID project like Chris, or they contribute seed to the Seed Exchange....... and all  such assistance for the Club is very much appreciated, I assure  you.
The discussions in these pages are  enlightening and I will be sure to have the comments and suggestions made here and in other similar pages, and those sent already to me, brought to the attention of the Council.

Duty bound though, to say here, as in the "Are you an SRGC Member" thread.... if you like this forum and you are not a full SRGC member  then please do consider joining the Club. The Journal is great  and  there's the Seed exchange too.. 

[Ragged Robin]

Hristo, I was just about to write about how much I considered input, like yours and Simon's, as an equally important way of contributing to the Club and enriching it with knowledge and information in a specialist way - your plant hunts and rare plant growing is just that and I personally have learnt a tremendous amount through your field trips which have been so inclusive and tolerant of novice questions. The Seed ID project is a remarkable undertaking and is a tremendous commitment too for all those concerned.

It is wonderful that so much information is generally free online but often you have to pay to get anything more than basic information on a subject - the open and welcoming nature of the SRGC Forum allows one to evaluate what you gain from the pages without pressure to commit, only gentle reminders!  It is up to the individual to decide whether to be paying Member or not..I think that is very fair and should encourage willing Membership.  I take your point about students and those abroad who cannot access the full benefits of Membership and do think that these could be addressed differently in a more user friendly way.

The internet is the way forward for communities and likeminded people to get-together and exchange views and I think the future of information technology is very exciting - before joining this Forum I was very sceptical about 'virtual gardening' but it is growing on me!

 

[Hristo]

 

[Paddy Tobin]

Chris makes a point above which I think should be central to the thoughts of the committee of the SRGC or any other similar organisation. He says that we should think as non-members when considering how to attract members, trying to figure out what it is the non-member wants and seeing if the club can provide that. Of course, there is also the consideration of marketing the product as it stands at present - believing that the SRGC is an excellent club as it stands and provides an excellent service and source of recreation to many already and convince non-members that they too would enjoy membership.

I will reiterate that, in my opinion, the success of the online SRGC is not because of organisational decisions but because of the people involved in running the site. It is the personal touch and not the organisation which has been so effective and successful.

Paddy

[Maggi Young]

I take your point about students and those abroad who cannot access the full benefits of Membership and do think that these could be addressed differently in a more user friendly way.

Robin made this comment in relation to what Chris said and this is the thought that immediately stuck me.... yes, there are aspects of the club : the local group meetings and the shows, that cannot be accessed by overseas members, but the website provides, in many ways, much more than that anyway..... the show reports here are often very extensive, and the other reports, travel etc. are so widespread and numerous as to  provide the equivalent of a local meeting  every other day, or a virtual Journal every few weeks! So I would state that as a reason why Membership of the SRGC, to support ALL the work the Club does, is worthwhile.
Without the financial backing of the Club, this site would not exist in this form and so all the overseas members would again be disenfranchised and the free access would disappear.

The aim of the open access to this site is to encourage everyone to take an interest.... whether they can afford to join the club or not.... but I see it as my duty to remind anyone reading who could afford the modest annual fee that it would, if nothing else, be ethical to support this resource!  

[tonyg]

I am aware of newspaper websites where some of the information is available to all while other parts require a subscription to be paid for access.  If the SRGC needs/wants to gain a financial commitment from 'web-only' members then this avenue might be one to consider.  The web subscription could be lower to reflect overall lower costs of this category of member.  As we move from a time at present when web using members are a (possible small) minority of the total to a time (5-20 years?) when the balance has shifted to a majority thiese considerations will become more and more relevant.  As Simon says : to fail to prepare is to prepare to fail

As an aside, the Crocus Group of which I am Secretary, is moving to email newsletters.  With no other overheads, if we can get all the membership onto email newsletters do we need to charge a subscription at all?

[Maggi Young]

As an aside, the Crocus Group of which I am Secretary, is moving to email newsletters.  With no other overheads, if we can get all the membership onto email newsletters do we need to charge a subscription at all?

An interesting aside.....
I very much doubt that many members would be pleased, or indeed able to receive an email version of the Journal in their inbox, Tony! The file is huge!

There is a considerable difficulty,  from a practical viewpoint, of the number of times some people change their email address.... given that we have members who forget for months or years that they have moved house.... only suddenly realising somewhere down the line that they have had no communication from the Club or that their Subscription is not paid, then the possiblilites of successfully emailling  everyone  becomes remote! Graham Bunkal is a marvel and achieves great results, but contacting people who are no longer where  he's been told they are , is beyond even his talents!