Aquilegia atropurpurea and Aquilegia viridiflora

[maggiepie]

I have some seeds germinating at the moment and am wondering if anyone who grows this could post a pic of the flower.

I can't find much information about this one.

[Giles]

Helen,
It's in Robert Nold's book 'Columbines':
45cm, Altai Mts > N.China, fragrant, lasts about 3 yrs. '...a fairly wonderful plant, and very much worth growing.'
No special requirement mentioned.
Illustration also from his (very nice) book.

[maggiepie]

Giles, thanks for the illustration but I can't see any difference between the illustration and Aquilegia viridiflora

Here's a few pics of one of my A. viridiflora seedlings last year.

[TheOnionMan]

There is also a cultivar going around named 'Chocolate Soldier', although don't see much of a difference in that one either, and it was short-lived for me.

[Maggi Young]

I have always found them short lived.... and they don't always set good seed here in Aberdeen ... for me, anyway... if any member living din this area  does get buckets of seed and wants to give me some, that would be nice!
 I suppose about three years would be their lifespan.... not very long. I do like them... the scent in a warm evening is delightful and I find the green and purple colour very pretty.

[maggiepie]

Maggi, I suspect you are right re the "atropurpurea" suffix. It will be interesting to see if these seedlings flower this year.
Of course they might not be what they are supposed to be.
My A. viridifloras will be 3 years old this season ( if they turn up)
I didn't get any seeds last year, I had to cut the flowers off due to the wee harlequin bugs, not to mention sawfly grubs that were all over the leaves feasting.
My plants were very small, only about 6 inches high.

[Diane Clement]

I'm inclined to think that this  "atropurpurea" suffix is a spurious one. These plants usually have a green and purple colouration..... perhaps someone once thought otherwise and so this naming came about.... to me it's not vaild.... particularly if the illustration is representative of the plant!

The common form in cultivation is ssp atropurpurea with the dark inner petals. 
The "type" form doesn't have the brown inners, hence viridiflora.  I've never seen it, I wonder whether it is rare or not in cultivation see picture here  http://www.abc.se/~m8449/Wwebb/zaquilvirid1.jpg

I've been trying to find a picture of my plant without success, it was shown at Cleveland and Midland last year, but it's difficult to photograph.  It is quite small, and has a fantastic scent.  It's just coming into growth this year.  It made lots of seed, one pot's worth kept, and the rest sent to the seed exchange.

In the pictures I have seen of 'Chocolate Soldier' it seems not to have such bright green sepals thereby showing less contrast, but I've not seen it in the flesh, so it may be identical with ssp atropurpurea, and so maybe just a marketing name by T&M.
 

[TheOnionMan]

Diane, this has me thinking of an interesting hybridization project (and with Aquilegia, it wouldn't be too difficult ), and that is to get any form of A. viridiflora and cross with A. glandulosa A. fragrans (I would need to re-obtain both at this point), the latter I once grew from a Chris Chadwell collection from the Himalayas, another Aquilegia with an intense fragrance, to start breeding for fragrance.  I like the all green (type viridiflora) shown in your JPG link. As I have grown it, then purchased a plant of so-called 'Chocolate Soldier, it is always the dark atropurpurea type.

Back to A. glandulosa A. fragrans, there are tall and dwarf forms in cultivation, some more or less frangrant than others.

[Diane Clement]

Bob Brown, proprietor of Cotswold Garden Flowers nursery, lists some other hybrids of A viridiflora, two with A brevistyla and one with A thalictrifolia, a couple with pictures on this page:

http://www.cgf.net/plants.php?genus=AQUILEGIA

[maggiepie]

I've been trying to find a picture of my plant without success, it was shown at Cleveland and Midland last year, but it's difficult to photograph.  It is quite small, and has a fantastic scent.  It's just coming into growth this year.  It made lots of seed, one pot's worth kept, and the rest sent to the seed exchange.

Diane, if you sent your seeds to AGS there's a distinct possibility that some of my seedlings are from your seeds.
 

[TheOnionMan]

Bob Brown, proprietor of Cotswold Garden Flowers nursery, lists some other hybrids of A viridiflora, two with A brevistyla and one with A thalictrifolia, a couple with pictures on this page:

http://www.cgf.net/plants.php?genus=AQUILEGIA

Very interesting!  The viridiflora x thalictrifolia looks awesome.  Some of the double aquilegia hybrids are freakish in my opinion, although some of the crosses between species are quite elegant.

[Lesley Cox]

I am of the opinion that the 'Chocolate Soldier' name is one of those dreamed up by nursery people to make the plant easier to sell, not necessarily a valid name in that the plant is no different from the species.

There's A. fragrans for your breeding programme Mark. I grew this from seed about 5 years ago and still have a few. They were all beautifully fragrant but possibly had some hybrid blood in them as the colour range was from straight cream to straight blue or lavender, and several quite pleasant combinations including some white.

[TheOnionMan]

I am of the opinion that the 'Chocolate Soldier' name is one of those dreamed up by nursery people to make the plant easier to sell, not necessarily a valid name in that the plant is no different from the species.

There's A. fragrans for your breeding programme Mark. I grew this from seed about 5 years ago and still have a few. They were all beautifully fragrant but possibly had some hybrid blood in them as the colour range was from straight cream to straight blue or lavender, and several quite pleasant combinations including some white.

I was incorrect in my memory of the fragrant Aquilegia from the Chris Chadwell Himalayan seed, you're quite right Lesley, it was indeed A. fragrans (note to myself, don't trust memory, always verify facts from records and references).  Mine from collected seed was a beautiful crealy white, I suspect anything of a different color these days is a hybrid.  I once grew some listed as A. fragrans from SEEDEX seed years after the Chadwell seed, and they were much taller and blue-tinged, and not as fragrant, again probably hybrids.

[Maggi Young]

McMark, you must expect your memory to play tricks when you are poisoning your system with pipe smoke... and you a runner, too!

[TheOnionMan]

McMark, you must expect your memory to play tricks when you are poisoning your system with pipe smoke... and you a runner, too!

Only my avatar alter-ego smokes (these avatars can be a shoddy lot), personally I don't touch the stuff.  Although after todays 5-miler, I was huffing and puffing (clean cold air).