Trillium 2010

[Michael J Campbell]

So change your labels to Trillium rivale 'Del Norte' and all will be well.

Done,

Thanks for pointing this out Rodger,I was a little suspicious myself but as this is the only plant that I bought (all the others are grown from seed) I didn't question the Name on the label because it came from a reputable nursery.

[alpines]

So change your labels to Trillium rivale 'Del Norte' and all will be well.

Pardon my naivety, but if this is not a hybrid, then why is it not simply T.rivale
If I acquire seed from a T. erectum in Anglin falls, am I at liberty to call it T. erectum 'Anglin Falls'?

[Lesley Cox]

Oh Hallelujia! At last someone NOT obsessed by adding cultivar names.

[Rodger Whitlock]

So change your labels to Trillium rivale 'Del Norte' and all will be well.

Pardon my naivety, but if this is not a hybrid, then why is it not simply T.rivale
If I acquire seed from a T. erectum in Anglin falls, am I at liberty to call it T. erectum 'Anglin Falls'?

Because somewhere, at some point in time, some nurseryman — possibly Boyd Kline when he owned the Siskiyou Rare Plant Nursery — assigned the name 'Del Norte' to a form of Trillium rivale from Del Norte County. The whole point was that the plant was distinctive in some way from run of the mill T. rivale. Remember, too, that the rules regarding the publication of cultivar names are a great deal less stringent than those regarding botanical names. A nursery catalog with a date on it is adequate.

I've actually seen an early reference to T. r. 'Del Norte' somewhere in my 35 years of wandering through the thickets of horticultural literature, but I've not been able to find it a second time, so I can't say just what the distinction was originally. Inquiries to the present day Siskiyou Rare Plant Nursery have gone unanswered. A very dim and very uncertain memory is that the original 'Del Norte' was a pure white form. Certainly the plants we're talking about show great vigor compared with everyday T. rivale (as though any trillium is "everyday"). In my own garden, the 'Del Norte' form seeds about so freely that it is slightly weedy.

As for your Trillium erectum 'Anglin Falls': by all means give your plant a cultivar name if it is distinctive.

I am dodging an important issue: was the original 'Del Norte' considered a clonal form, or was the name applied to a seed strain? I honestly don't know.

There are a very few other cultivars of T. rivale, viz. 'Purple Heart' and 'Vern Ahier'. I have 'Purple Heart' from an extremely reputable source, but oddly enough a seedling of (supposedly) T. r. 'Rosea' has a much darker, purpler heart! 'Vern Ahier' is a clone, characterized by unusually broad, overlapping petals, white with red speckling. It's fully within the normal range of variation of T. rivale, however, and if you raise enough seedlings with a sufficiently diverse gene pool, you will get plants that resemble it in various ways.

I will accept that the situation is a mess, but at some point the only way to preserve one's sanity is to throw one's hands up in despair and accept the judgement of people with greater experience in such matters.

At the end of the day, the fact remains that supposed T. ovatum × rivale are misnamed, and are definitely not hybrids.

[Lesley Cox]

I'm pretty sure there was a lot of discussion re this whole T. rivale x ovatum thing, and subsequent ID as rivale 'Del Norte' on Trillium-L, maybe 2 or 3 years ago or more, before I became bored with the whole thing and opted out. 4 months of hearing that everone's Trillium this or that was flowering and 8 months of hearing that it wasn't, not to mention all the hoo-ha about whether this or that species WAS a species and whether it lived on this or that side of some road in deepest Tennessee.

[t00lie]

Hello Michael/Rodger

Here is a pic from back in Sept. of a large Trillium rivale doing the rounds down here in NZ as T.rivale 'large white' with a normal sized T.rivale for comparison .

This one as well seeds around all over the place--with the rhizome multiplying vigorously.Over Easter i split a clump up again to pot up 6 plants to give away in the spring.

Lesley while i'm also no longer a member of Trillium L i do visit regularly as there have been some wonderful Trillium pics posted to the aligned photo gallery.

Cheers Dave.

[johnw]

A few Trilliums from yesterday.

albidum
erectum
grandiflorum double
cuneatum

johnw

[alpines]

Trillium variety in Anglin Falls, Kentucky

[Diane Whitehead]

What wonderfully varied trilliums - and only one cultivar name.
Such a contrast to snowdrops!

[Anthony Darby]

 

[Lesley Cox]

Are these erectums Alan, or maybe flexipes? The variation is wonderful.

[alpines]

Are these erectums Alan, or maybe flexipes? The variation is wonderful.

Well I believe they are erectum. They all have the maroon ovary but I'm far from an expert on trilliums. According to Flora of North America, T.erectum has "ovary dark purple to maroon, even in white-flowered forms" whilst it lists T.flexipes has having "ovary white,"

[Lesley Cox]

Oh yes, thanks, I should have known that. In fact, I DID know it, somewhere in the dim dark recesses of what's left of my brain.

[alpines]

And I should have mentioned too that T.flexipes is more prevalent towards the west of Kentucky. Anglin Falls (or more correctly the John B. Stephenson Memorial Forest) is more Inner Bluegrass being in the Berea Forest area. Interestingly, we have never seen flexipes in the wild. Not that it doesn't grow near us, more that our compass always takes us east.

[illingworth]

We are still on slow dial-up and don't get a chance to contribute, or even read, very much on the forum. This tiny beauty is the first of our trilliums to bloom  - Trillium nivale - the snow trillium.  This year the snow has gone quickly, and it is blooming about two weeks sooner than normal. Although you can't see them, the first seedlings are appearing under the leaves. This plant is from a small start in 06.

Sharon