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Author Topic: Allium 2010  (Read 132487 times)

dominique

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #90 on: March 26, 2010, 07:16:52 AM »
absolutely a stunner indeed ! Thank you Oron
Dom
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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #91 on: March 26, 2010, 02:05:43 PM »
Mark:

Thank you for starting this link---on behalf of all of us who love "those nasty onions"  (ex Mr. Porteous of the Ontario Rock Garden Society)...

Am very grateful for the joint expertise offered here and will surely return, again and again, as the season progresses in the hopes of identifying so many no-names or incorrectly-named species.

Maggi---may I vote for this topic to be transferred into the "Topics Too Good To Lose" section.



so many species....so little time

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Maggi Young

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #92 on: March 27, 2010, 12:12:16 AM »
Mark:

Thank you for starting this link---on behalf of all of us who love "those nasty onions"  (ex Mr. Porteous of the Ontario Rock Garden Society)...

Am very grateful for the joint expertise offered here and will surely return, again and again, as the season progresses in the hopes of identifying so many no-names or incorrectly-named species.

Maggi---may I vote for this topic to be transferred into the "Topics Too Good To Lose" section.


It appears that the Scottish emigrant to Canada, Barrie Porteous, has the same attitude to onions as Ian Young has to snowdrops! ;)

Ian and I have discussed  your proposal to move this thread, Kristl, but we have decided that it is better left here in the Bulb Section where it is logically placed meantime. I'll set the topic "sticky" so it is at the "front" of the section. At the end of the year we might rename it and  move it then.
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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johnw

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #93 on: March 27, 2010, 01:47:10 PM »
It appears that the Scottish emigrant to Canada, Barrie Porteous, has the same attitude to onions as Ian Young has to snowdrops! ;)

Yes Maggi, but knowing said devious Mr. Porteous you can be almost certain he has a large collection of Alliums tucked away at his cottage.  It's been awhile and I must write to him, I was sure he was English!  ;)

johnw
John in coastal Nova Scotia

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #94 on: March 27, 2010, 02:03:54 PM »
Quote
It's been awhile and I must write to him, I was sure he was English!  Wink
Gracious me!Really?  The thought never occurred to me.... he used to live in Edinburgh and his dear Mother (who may no longer be alive) who still  lived in Edinburgh,  was a happy golfing lady, whose pedigree I never questioned  :-X
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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johnw

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #95 on: March 27, 2010, 02:25:41 PM »
Quote
It's been awhile and I must write to him, I was sure he was English!  Wink
Gracious me!Really?  The thought never occurred to me.... he used to live in Edinburgh and his dear Mother (who may no longer be alive) who still  lived in Edinburgh,  was a happy golfing lady, whose pedigree I never questioned  :-X

Let's just say we will soon find out if he is a lurker!

johnw
John in coastal Nova Scotia

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #96 on: March 29, 2010, 09:56:13 PM »
Mark:

Thank you for starting this link---on behalf of all of us who love "those nasty onions"  (ex Mr. Porteous of the Ontario Rock Garden Society)...

Am very grateful for the joint expertise offered here and will surely return, again and again, as the season progresses in the hopes of identifying so many no-names or incorrectly-named species.

Maggi---may I vote for this topic to be transferred into the "Topics Too Good To Lose" section.


Thanks Kristl for your vote of confidence, and to Maggi for making the topic "sticky" :o.  So, let's get back to those nasty onions.  Always the first to bloom for me is a controversial one, Allium paradoxum var. normale.  Vilified as a terrible pest by many, and probably warranting this claim in the type species that has largish bulbils spoiling the inflorescence, in var. normale there are no bulbils, just a head of lovely drooping pure white bell-shaped flowers.  My plant is from a Paul Furse 5085 collection in Iran.

At least here in New England, it shall never become a pest, as it is slightly less hardy than it needs to be to prosper.  After nearly 20 years growing this, I'm down to a few bulbs.  The problem is, the foliage comes up very early, but is not very frost-proof, nor are the early flower buds, and in many years it gets whacked by late frosts.  My photos will demonstrate an example this year, where after our earliest spring in the last 10 years, suddenly a few days ago it went down to 18 degrees F (-9 C), and it turned some of the foliage to mush, although the buds survived.

So why was it name paradoxum (meaning strange or anomalous)?  I could not find anything online to suggest an answser, the only publication which might offer an answer is "A PARADOXICAL ONION, ALLIUM PARADOXUM var. NORMALE (p 194-201) William T. Stearn" published in Curtis's Botanical Magazine; Volume 4, Issue 4, although I do not have access to a free version of that publication.

I'm going to take a guess, the anomalous aspect of this allium is the disposition of the single leaf each bulb produces. With a casual glance, you'd think the leaf is normal, a broad arching leaf of a shining light green color.  However, the leaves curiously have a raised mid vein on the "upper" surface... unheard of!  Upon closer inspection, one realizes the leaves are actually upsidedown!  Yes, the leaf comes up and arches forward over the growing point, protecting the emerging flower bud beneath, presenting the shiny, raised-veined underside of the leaf to the sky!  A paradox to be sure.  The true "upper" surface of the leaf is matte (not shining) and no visible midvein.

Photo 1 - 5 bulbs/leaves emerging, March 26, 2010, the bulbs being overtaken by an Allium senescens/nutans hybrid which fill my Allium beds.
Photo 2 - two days later, March 28, 2010, showing the leaf damage after a night that went down to -9C.
Photo 3 - lifting the upsidedown leaf to reveal the emerging spathed buds.
Photo 4 - plants in flower, taken May 8, 2001
« Last Edit: March 29, 2010, 10:01:55 PM by TheOnionMan »
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com

partisangardener

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #97 on: March 30, 2010, 09:24:21 PM »
Found this allium ursinum last year. It emerged the same way.
greetings from Bayreuth/Germany zone 6b (340 m)
Axel
sorry I am no native speaker, just picked it up.

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #98 on: March 31, 2010, 03:32:08 AM »
Found this allium ursinum last year. It emerged the same way.

Hi Axel, a most interesting variegation, thanks for sharing this!  While variegation is relatively rare in Allium, it does occur.  I have a couple young plants of a variegated Allium nutans form, both are weak growers.  In my garden in 2009, I found two seedlings of Allium angulosum that were variegated, one to an extreme amount (nearly all white), although both were eaten to the ground by a woodchuck (probably as delectable as blanched asparagus), so hopefully they will come back to life this year.

And, I offer up a photo of three variegated forms of Allium tricoccum found by Darrell Probst in central Massachusetts, USA, in 2009, showing varying degrees of variegation, whether white or yellow on green, or deep purple on green.  It is certainly worth checking out such plants, and if they are consistent from year to year, to consider introducing them.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2010, 03:34:56 AM by TheOnionMan »
Mark McDonough
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TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #99 on: March 31, 2010, 04:10:38 AM »
Hello Allium fans,

I am privileged to be in receipt of a recent beautifully produced publication focusing on garlic and the genus Allium, "Garlic and Other Alliums: The Lore and the Science", By Eric Block, Published by The Royal Society of Chemistry, Cambridge, UK
RSCPublishing: http://www.rsc.org/shop/books/
2010, 474 p., Hardcover
ISBN: 978-0-85404-190-9

Dr. Eric Block is a professor of Chemistry at the University at Albany, State University of New York (SUNY), well known for decades for work done on the complicated chemistry of Allium species.

The link above includes downloadable PDFs for the entire Chapter 1, Table of Contents, and Author Information.

The book is also available from Google Books
Many more tantalizing preview pages available here... dig in and take a look :o :o
Use the "Contents button, and other viewing button options, for your preferred viewing experience.
http://books.google.com/books?id=6AB89RHV9ucC&printsec=frontcover&dq=garlic+and+other+alliums&ei=uR8cS8etEofkyQSJ783fCw#v=onepage&q=&f=false

I upload a screen capture showing the Google Books site that offers a sampling of book content, and an image of the book cover showing the serpent garlic.
« Last Edit: March 31, 2010, 03:43:19 PM by TheOnionMan »
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
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antennaria at aol.com

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #100 on: April 01, 2010, 02:39:58 AM »
As follow-up to the previous posting about the new book Garlic and Other Alliums: The Lore and the Science, the author Dr. Eric Block asks the following:

"I have access to a unique instrument (DART Mass Spectrometer) which makes it possible to very rapidly identify the strong-smelling sulfur containing volatiles from the leaves, shoots or bulbs of any Allium species, which can be very useful for taxonomy.

It would great to ask the SRGC readers about their choices for very strongly smelling alliums as well as the chances of my obtaining reasonably fresh samples for testing. I would also be interested in "exotic" alliums from "exotic" locations."


If you have information to contribute to Dr. Eric Block's scientific efforts, he can be contacted at: eb801@albany.edu

Photo uploaded showing a DART-MS (Direct Analysis in Real Time Mass Spectrometry) machine... impressive!  :o
« Last Edit: April 01, 2010, 02:43:27 AM by TheOnionMan »
Mark McDonough
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antennaria at aol.com

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #101 on: April 01, 2010, 03:37:29 AM »
I always suggest that is important to retry growing the same species from multiple sources.  Too often our knowledge of any plant species is from a single mass-produced source, certainly true with bulbs, depriving our knowledge of the true breadth of variability of a plant species.  Even something as common as nodding onion, Allium cernuum, can be had in amazingly diverse and beautiful forms (and nondescript ugly forms) from such efforts.

So it is true with Allium caeruleum, widely cultivated and surely mass-produced from a single clone for many decades.  The problem is, the plant widely available in fall bulb bins at local nursery centers is an inferior form; flowers are indeed a good dark blue, but there's a tendency to produce an odd bulbil or two or three in the inflorescence, the flower heads often with amusingly weird aberrant florets.... multi-petaled ones, fused florets, or situations where a stamen morphs into a pedicel and sprouts one or more flowers from within a flower :o :o.  Invariably the widely cultivated type is short-lived, only flowering well the first year after planting, dying out quickly in subsequent years.  They're cheap enough to buy, but I was tired of these bad habits and replanting bulbs every couple of years.

Then one day, Panayoti Kelaidis sent me a photo of this blue allium growing at Denver Botanic Garden (DBG), and I couldn't believe my eyes... a gorgeous form with brilliant azure blue flowers in heads larger than normal, and taller too.  Afterwards, he sent me a good crop of bulbs.  Determined to get a good form established, I planted bulbs out in 7-8 spots around the garden, hoping to find just the right spot to the plant's liking.  And sure enough, the bulbs only really prospered in one location, the successful one now forming basal offsets and bulblets to try again in other locations.  Here are some photos of what I have dubbed the 'DBG Form'.

1.  Allium caeruleum in a mixed planting at Denver Botanic Garden, beautiful!
2.  close-up of the same planting
3.  In my garden, a close-up of a single flower head in 2008, 3" (7.5 cm) in diameter.
4.  In my garden, several azure flower heads in 2009, at early anthesis with intense color of young buds.
5.  In late summer, bulblets can be found at the stem bases bulging friom the basal leaf sheaths, harvest and replant.
6.  Spring growth 2010 shows much dividing and increasing, some of the bulblets replanted near mother plant are sprouting.
    (Aster pilosus growing nearby... I must post on the "Frost Aster")


« Last Edit: April 01, 2010, 03:39:55 AM by TheOnionMan »
Mark McDonough
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USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com

Stephenb

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #102 on: April 01, 2010, 11:29:08 AM »
Thanks very much for the book link, OnionMan - need some time to digest (I think the chemistry will go over my head though, not being my best subject - nevertheless, fascinating to learn that the chemistry is so complicated - adds a new dimension...).

Allium paradoxum: I've had the weedy one in my garden for some time and it's spread only slowly. I would normally be eating it at this time of year, but the very cold winter seems to have killed it.... :( Interesting what you say about the leaves.

Variegation: this is something I'd often wondered about as I'd never come across a variegated Allium although I have a nice variegated Tulbaghia violacea (Silver Lace). Incidentally, I find the Tulbaghias very strong smelling...
Stephen
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TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #103 on: April 01, 2010, 02:34:37 PM »
Thanks very much for the book link, OnionMan - need some time to digest (I think the chemistry will go over my head though, not being my best subject - nevertheless, fascinating to learn that the chemistry is so complicated - adds a new dimension...).

Variegation: this is something I'd often wondered about as I'd never come across a variegated Allium although I have a nice variegated Tulbaghia violacea (Silver Lace). Incidentally, I find the Tulbaghias very strong smelling...

Chemistry goes way over my head too... thank goodness for smart folks like Dr. Block to help advance the sciences.  But I'm able to glean enough from the information to arrive at that new dimension :D

Tulbaghia is a fascinating genus, I've grown a number over the years, although presently without any.  All parts of the plant stink if bruised, so it's interesting that the often tiny flowers can pack such powerfully sweet perfumes (overcompensating for it's stinkiness no doubt ;D).  That said, I encourage people to take a look around at David Fenwick's The African Garden site at: http://www.theafricangarden.com/page42.html, I'm sure a familiar destination to SRGC members.
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com

TheOnionMan

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Re: Allium 2010
« Reply #104 on: April 01, 2010, 02:49:53 PM »
Dr. Eric Block has shared with me a few photos taken while visiting the St. Petersburg Botanical Garden in Russia in 2008, showing an most attractive form of Allium caeruleum growing there.  Eric gave permission to share these with you.

1.  Allium caeruleum - closeup
2.  Allium caeruleum - blue drumsticks
3.  Allium caeruleum - bulb
4.  view of a section of the garden where the alliums were growing, St. Petersburg Botanical Garden 2008
Mark McDonough
Massachusetts, USA (near the New Hampshire border)
USDA Zone 5
antennaria at aol.com

 


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