Iris and some Irids 2010

[PeterT]

jaimie your plant matches what I know as Iris orientalis which I grow from several cultivated sources, they vary in the amount of yellow but the shape of the flower is always the same, I don't believe Chris's plant is orientalis,
I am not familiar with carthaliniae.
Here is Iris gramminia ( this should read graminea) in the form I think is known as pseudocyperus which is about 1 m or 3 feet tall, a PCI seedling sold to me as Iris thomsonii which is supposed to be a purple form of Innominata, and two Iris sibirica hybreds, Reddy Maid and Silver Edge. 

[arillady]

I do envy those who can grow sibericas.
Such beautiful forms being shown.

[Lesley Cox]

I agree that Chris's iris is probably (what I know as) I. carthaliniae. It is a very elegant and upright plant, very attractive.

I don't grow I. graminea var. pseudocyperus but so far as I know it shouldn't be so tall as that. It is distinguished from the type by the flowers over-topping the foliage instead of being buried among it as in most graminea plants. Easier to see and to sniff at.

[Lesley Cox]

The thomsonii seedling is very nice Peter. I wonder if yours is from the same seed as mine, (Jim Archibald) which germinated well then all damped off.

[PeterT]

Hello Lesley,
 the thomsoni came from Jim Almond as a seedling, I don't know whose seed have you any Idea what I should call this gramminia then? my other gramminias are small dainty plants  similar in size to sintinisii, Brian Mathew describes pseudocyperus as "larger and more robust" than I gramminia gramminia (corectly spelt Iris graminia)

[Lesley Cox]

Hello Lesley,
 the thomsoni came from Jim Almond as a seedling, I don't know whose seed have you any Idea what I should call this gramminia then? my other gramminias are small dainty plants  similar in size to sintinisii, Brian Mathew describes pseudocyperus as "larger and more robust" than I gramminia gramminia

My own graminea grows to about the size of a biggish innominata but of course has leaves which bend over and are floppy. My sintenisii is quite a lot smaller/shorter.

Why are we spelling graminea differently. You've typed it enough not to be a slip of the finger. Has the spelling been changed recently?

[Diane Whitehead]

Here is the darkest "thompsonii" I have found - on French Hill Road
in northern California.  It is really an innominata.

[Diane Whitehead]

This innominata is in my garden.  I am surprised that it is flowering
so late.  I like its daintiness - neat shiny leaves, small flowers.

The various Pacific Coast hybrids started flowering in mid-April
and many have finished flowering already.

[Lesley Cox]

That is a lovely purple Diane. It's not unlike my so-called "dwarf" douglasiana.


Now I look at mine, it is quite different, with more yellow in it apart from anything else. This iris has always been something of a mystery to me. It is certainly dwarfer than other douglasianas I've grown and has the typical wide, glossy and very tough leaves but seedlings vary a great deal. This is a seedling from my original which I lost - can't remember how - and most seedlings are pretty much true to flower colour and size but some have been quite tall while a few have been just a few centimetres tall. I have one seedling at present, at least 8 months old and only 3 cms tall. Whether it will stay like that when planted out, I've yet to find out.

[Maggi Young]

Why are we spelling graminea differently. You've typed it enough not to be a slip of the finger. Has the spelling been changed recently?

I was wondering about that too.... most of the sources I see have graminea, though SIGNA does show graminia .
IPNI only shows  graminea


Perhaps Diane C., who I regard as my guru in such matters, will mosey along and help out??

[PeterT]

Sorry all, its my bad spelling, I am usually tierd when i get to the computer and I revert to phonetic spellings, strange dipthongs etc. the Iris is properly Iris graminea
Peter

[PeterT]

Beautifull blue innominata Diane, are the leaves grey as the picture suggests? the width of the fall in your yellow plant reminds me of the fall in the small form I pictured. How strange your douglasii should vary so much in size Lesley, it does look lovely though, mine is sulking after being turfed out of its home this spring for swamping smaller plants. best moved in the autome.

[Diane Clement]

Why are we spelling graminea differently. You've typed it enough not to be a slip of the finger. Has the spelling been changed recently?

I was wondering about that too.... most of the sources I see have graminea, though SIGNA does show graminia .    IPNI only shows  graminea
Perhaps Diane C., who I regard as my guru in such matters, will mosey along and help out??  

Flattered to be (incorrectly) called a guru    I just have lots of name references at my fingertips, and have a feeling for which are reliable!

The sources I use have Iris graminea.

For anyone wishing to know why, here's the references:
For any monocot, the first place to check is the Kew database.  The database is is the result of 15 or so years of classifying in the light of DNA research rather than morphological aspects of flower structure (in some areas, it does reveal some unlikely and new relationships and breaks some other long-held ones, and as such, is unlikely to be accepted by everyone).  The best way to use it, by the way, is to type in a genus on the genus page and then just look through the species and subspecies listed.  In general, there has been a lot of lumping of subspecies into their species.

here's the page for Iris graminea:
Iris graminea

It is worth looking in the International Plant Name Index, but do PLEASE remember this is a historical document, it lists many species as originally published, but not enough cross references to sort out synonyms and revisions.  It is absolutely riddled with errors and spelling mistakes (some of them copied from the original documentation).  Because of these, IPNI is NOT a document to check that a name is current, purely that a name has existed at some point in time.  It does have its uses, because of the way the search is organised, it is possible to put a wild card into the search which is useful if you suspect a spelling error has been made.  In this case, typing in Iris gram*  reveals this page, Iris graminea has five references (we cannot rely on any of these, as we do not know from this whether it has had a name change.)  Interestingly Iris graminifolia and Iris graminiflora are also listed, which may account for misspelling of Iris graminia.  Neither of these we can make any sense of, from the IPNI, but if we go back to Kew, we will find that I x graminiflora is a synonym for I x geminiflora and I graminifolia (Freyn) is a synonym for I kerneriana and I graminifolia (Pall) is unplaced, possibly meaning that the publication is ambiguous.
Anyone still awake  

Iris gram*

I did take a look at SIGNA (The Species Iris Group of North America).  Here's the full list of species:
http://www.signa.org/index.pl?Species

and I found Iris graminea listed:
http://www.signa.org/index.pl?Iris-graminea

[Maggi Young]

Thasnks  Diane.... for sorting us out and for finally getting it through my thick skull not to rely on IPNI too much!

By the way: this from  Advayataraka Upanishad 14—18, verse 5   (Sanskrit literature)

    The syllable gu means shadows
    The syllable ru, he who disperses them,
    Because of the power to disperse darkness
    the guru is thus named.

Or more simply put.... a teacher.....

    

[olegKon]

Iris halophila flowering for the first time for me