Crocus januari 2012

[Janis Ruksans]

About biflorus taurii - I can't judge - it looks a little suspicious, but may be not,  so I kept silence. But -plant on Zvone's entry looks 100% virus infected.
Janis

[Peppa]

Just curious, but what is the difference in symptoms between a non-permanent genetic fault and a virus in this case? I am familiar with the obvious virus symptoms, but every time I notice a streak in one of my flowers, I get nervous...

[Gerry Webster]

Just curious, but what is the difference in symptoms between a non-permanent genetic fault and a virus in this case?

I am not entirely sure what one is to understand by "a non-permanent genetic fault". In view of Janis' phrasing I suspect one is to interpret it as some interference in gene expression during development. I would guess that this might give rise to symptoms which could be indistinguishable from those produced by a virus infection. I think the only way an amateur could  make the distinction is by waiting to see whether the symptoms  recur in the following year.

 

[Tony Willis]

First Crocus biflorus - taurii I believe
Poor photo but the light levels were awful

Hope it's just the light levels but that flower looks a bit streaky to me 

Surely "It is non-permanent genetic fault which happensd during organogenezis of flower parts and so will not be inherited and other flowers from same corm and next year flowers must look normally."   
David S did not notice any potential virus.

Hmm - David is much more polite than I am ..... and hopefully Janis is right  here also.  I am a bit paranoid about virus having suffered from the problems of monoculture here 

Am I missing something,I cannot see a comment by David S,either polite or impolite?

[daveyp1970]

First Crocus biflorus - taurii I believe
Poor photo but the light levels were awful

Hope it's just the light levels but that flower looks a bit streaky to me 

Surely "It is non-permanent genetic fault which happensd during organogenezis of flower parts and so will not be inherited and other flowers from same corm and next year flowers must look normally."   
David S did not notice any potential virus.

Hmm - David is much more polite than I am ..... and hopefully Janis is right  here also.  I am a bit paranoid about virus having suffered from the problems of monoculture here 

Am I missing something,I cannot see a comment by David S,either polite or impolite?

Tony who is David S?

[art600]

David S is David Stephens - Tony Goode took over from David in the Crocus Group.

I sent him a photo of the biflorus taurii - he made no comment about possible virus.

[Janis Ruksans]

When the different colour is caused by genetic problem it is expressed on one petal or some part of flower, the rest remains typical. When during organogenesis of flower at some point happens mutation of colour all further cells which develops from mutant cell keeps changed colour, but others multiplies with normal gene complex and normal colour. Such plants where some part is normal, other with mutation are named "chimer".
When mutation happens in first cell of replacement corm all further cells contains mutation genes and you will receive plant with some new features - such new forms/cultivars are named "sports". Such sport is, for example Crocus sieberi 'George' mutant of famous 'Hubert Edelsten' with larger, more rounded and with different blooming time. Another sport is cv. 'Violet Vanguard" which arise in stock of 'Vanguard' with slightly darker flowers. Mutations where color changes only on one or more petals (or its part only) usually are not inherited because they happened later when new flower is formed. Many hostas with variegated leaves are of chimeric origin.
Virus is infection which spreads in all parts of plant and so stripes appear on all petals, they are irregular.

Not easy for me explain such things in English, but I hope that you understand.

Janis

[daveyp1970]

Thank you Janis that does help.

[Gerry Webster]

Janis - it appears that you are talking about somatic mutation?

[Janis Ruksans]

Janis - it appears that you are talking about somatic mutation?

Yes.
Janis

[Peppa]

Janis, thanks for the clarification! That makes sense, and I appreciate your taking the time to write out a great explanation!

[tonyg]

Here are a few in flower in the collection recently.

First of the spring flowerers was Crocus imperati, a pot of seedlings raised from the clone 'de Jager' which most likely crossed with an imperati suaveolens.
Crocus nevadensis - a form better in bud than open.
Crocus sieberi ?sublimis.  labelled as this taxa but rather pale in flower.
Crocus sieberi sieberi - two views of the first one out.
Crocus pestalozzae - seasonal mutation with 8 petals.  The leaves appear heavily virussed or perhaps the brown areas are a rust?  Either way I'm keeping it with the others

.....Spot the (now ex) aphid in one of these pics 

[tonyg]

I meant to post this link with the last lot of pics

http://www.west-crete.com/flowers/crocus_sieberi.htm

Some great habitat and close up shots of Crocus sieberi ssp sieberi in Crete

[Janis Ruksans]

Tony,
Many thanks for excellent link to Cretan Crocus sieberi, but there are a lot of other valuable information, too - car rent, hotels etc. I'm going there in March just to picture sieberi in its variability.

Regarding picture of pestalozzae - I can't see any symptom of virus on flower. Of course are viruses which expresses only on leaves, but if it is rust - don't worry - there are excellent chemicals against this problem which even cure off infection. Personally I'm using TILT - used against rust in grain crops (you can ask it to some farmer), only be carefull with dosing, not overdose. For liquid TILT dosage for ornamentals is 4 cubic cm on 10 liters of water. I had rust problem on Allium and during two seasons completely cleaned my stocks from this disease. Most important - to make first spray before symptoms appear and second some 3 weeks later. If symptoms are visible, it will stop spreading and in most cases corm will alive. Next season start spraying when leaves are some 3-5 cm long and repeat twice with 3-4 weeks interval and all will be OK. Now are several chemicals against wide spectrum of rusts, but I'm still using old TILT. Now every spring I'm still doing one spray to all bulbs when leaves of Alliums open. Rust can damage many bulbs I saw it in wild on Erythroniums, Fritillaria, juno irises etc. For vthis reason I'm making profilactic spray to all bulbs in greenhouses and outside, too.

Janis

[Oron Peri]

C. hartmannianus is starting to bloom,
Buds are as beautiful as the open flowers.