Crocus February 2012

[Martin Baxendale]

Do purists turn their noses up at natural hybrids found in the wild? It's purely geographical chance that keeps species apart which are capable of producing hybrids. As far as I'm concerned, hybridisation is a perfectly natural process. Of course selection of hybrid offspring for aesthetic purposes is another matter altogether, and especially if it's used to produce ever more extreme versions of the flowers involved. That's a matter of taste. I agree with Maggi that there's obviously room for both camps. The purists simply don't have to acquire the hybrids but concentrate on maintaining the species (whatever "species" means). Hybrising in cultivation has no impact on the species in the wild and may even reduce the pressure on wild species by collectors if more vigorous hybrids are available for the gardener. Ron, gene mixing within a species is obviously healthy but it doesn't usually produce the same sort of added vigour that hybridisation  can produce. For example, many of the popular and strong-growing "Chrysanthus" crocus are  hybrids between true chrysanthus and biflorus.

[ronm]

All valid points Martin.

[tonyg]

We both  run the risk of being shot, Ron     Personally, I don't know why we can't try to do both... preserve species through vegetative propagation and make the occasional hybrid for some added vigour here and there 

I'd second that but some species are very slow vegetative increasers.  Intra-specific hybrids, between clones of the same taxa, are what I aim for.  If nothing else this gives much better seed set and helps me increase the plants.  Mind you, what with the trials of nature and the undiscriminating bees, I get all sorts of oddities!

[Martin Baxendale]

I'm not anti species purists of course. I fully understand where they're coming from, and why it's important to maintain pure species in cultivation (for our enjoyment and, increasingly, as a conservation measure). I just don't have a problem with having hybrids too, as garden plants that are often more amenable to cultivation than pure species. I imagine some species purists worry that the hybrids may push out the species in gardeners' affections. But I'd imagine there will always be enough "specialist" gardeners who want to grow the species. At least I hope so.

[Hoy]

Speaking of hybrids - do sieberii and tomassianus cross? I have some plants occurring in my lawn that I suddenly realized could be such a cross. Picture:

[Roma]

Crocus 'Ruby Giant' in a pot in the cold frame
Crocus tommasinianus 'Whitewell Purple' in grass in my brother's garden.  I think it is over 30 years since I planted it there.
I must plant more crocuses in my own garden.

[Martin Baxendale]

Speaking of hybrids - do sieberii and tomassianus cross? I have some plants occurring in my lawn that I suddenly realized could be such a cross. Picture:

It's highly unlikely. They're not at all closely related. These look like pure tommasinianus to me.

[Hoy]

Speaking of hybrids - do sieberi and tomassianus cross? I have some plants occurring in my lawn that I suddenly realized could be such a cross. Picture:

It's highly unlikely. They're not at all closely related. These look like pure tommasinianus to me.

OK, thanks. It's what I thought but I noticed that the tepals, stamens and stigmas vary a lot. Some do look more like sieberi than tomassinianus.

[Martin Baxendale]

You can get a lot of variation from seed in tommasinianus. Sieberi has a yellow throat and I can't see any sign of that in your crocus.

[Hoy]

You can get a lot of variation from seed in tommasinianus. Sieberi has a yellow throat and I can't see any sign of that in your crocus.

OK, no yellow throats on these! Thanks.

[Janis Ruksans]

You can get a lot of variation from seed in tommasinianus. Sieberi has a yellow throat and I can't see any sign of that in your crocus.

OK, no yellow throats on these! Thanks.

I agree with Martin. I'm now in mountains so not often can reach internet and so rarely checking entries.
Janis

[ronm]

Wishing you good hunting Janis,  .
Travel safe please.

[JimF]

Jim.
Take another look at your C kosaninii.  It does not look like the ones I grow.   Maybe it's just a trick of the light, as can happen with photos, but it looks a bit like C etruscus or C dalmaticus to me.

Thanks, Tony, for the heads up. You're right that it's probably not kosaninii. I was given 4 clumps of crocus, 4 names and told I could match them up! Three plants matched perfectly three names. So the last I thought was within reasonable, far-end variation of C. kos., looking at the books, etc. (but not noting the tunic before planting). I've written my friend to see what else he's growing, all bought from one vendor in the past 10 years. C. etruscus does looks very close.

Jim

[Gerry Webster]

Do crocuses get Stagonospora? A pot of C. fleischeri appears to be badly infected by it. Also, my pot of C. minimus, has only froduced a few shoots this year. I knocked them out to have a look, expecting to find the others rotten, or eaten, but they are fine and firm, but still dormant. Any ideas?

I don't know about Stagonospora, but crocus do not appear to be doing well this year. A number of mine have very unhealthy looking leaves & others have just disappeared. I assume this is the effect of the severe cold of the 10-11 winter exacerbated by the cold snap this winter.