Fritillaria 2012

[Hillview croconut]

Also there have been suggestions that taking this matter to the EPA has to be some herculean struggle. The bullets have already been made here on the thread. Its up to any NZ citizen or the Group, if they want, to fire them. No-one has to be an expert. Use the internet to do a survey to confirm what everyone already knows (that the genus fritillaria represents no environmental risk). Its then a simple case of presenting those facts to the EPA and asking the question.
 At the very least the Group will know what they are up against or the very best the lack of evidence and logic behind individual assessments will be exposed.
 Cheers, Marcus

[Lesley Cox]

I'm sorry Gerry if it seemed the UK Fritillaria Group were being attacked. That is far from the case and I enjoy and profit by my membership of that excellent Group. If nothing else, it's such a pleasure to see good photographs of species which we may not grow or import to New Zealand. Marcus's comments and my own were born out of deep frustration with a system which is based on high and right principles but which is practised in such a way as utterly to preclude common sense and, frequently, the desired results.

[Lesley Cox]

David you are right in that if no counter-action takes place, regimes like that of the former East Germany flourish. They not only flourish but expand rapidly. You know the (mis)quotation that it only takes people of good intent to do nothing, for evil to flourish. Haven't got the words quite right but you know what I mean.

It is a fact now that many major crimes such as arson, kidnap, manslaughter et al attract lesser sentences in New Zealand in many circumstances than the illegal import of animal or plant material. Of course we have a uniquely valuable environment in New Zealand and of course we must protect it but the resources for that purpose are frequently misdirected and sometimes with dire results. I notice that the instant fine for having an apple in one's luggage at the airport has risen from $250 to $400 recently. Yet horses, dogs and other animals are routinely imported for breeding and other purposes with very short quarantine periods, just a matter of weeks in fact. Anthony could confirm or correct this if he cares to. We can't even bring in a plant with 12 months quarantine because the associated costs are so high, literally thousands of dollars.

Enjoy what we've got and continue to do do nothing? OK, if you think the status quo will remain. But it won't. Most here would perhaps claim (smugly) no interest in politics but half an eye on this country's political regimes of any colour, and their associated and powerful lobby groups, will not only soon have all organic imports banned, including seed of exotic plants, but will set about ridding New Zealand of species already here and once that becomes a reality, the momentum will increase year by year. Doing nothing, and having no interest in politics are not stances of which to be proud.

If there is any doubt about the Stasi-like action of the plant police, read the link supplied by Ashley on page 37.

No more on this subject from me.

[Lesley Cox]

Except that I can't resist, can I? I have just re-read the whole of this discussion since the posts re F. milasense and it seems there is a suggestion that because I have a nursery and will be the one to profit from any newly imported species, I have the financial resources and the responsibility to do the necessary work.

Yes, I have a very tiny nursery and love to have a few frits to sell but they are distributed for peanuts compared to the cost of raising them. I don't sell to make a living - few nursery people do nowadays - I sell because I have choice and sometime rare material which it is a pleasure for me to share. I give as much as sell and make a point of sharing rare or difficult material rather than risk it being lost altogether perhaps in my sole care. My nursery colleague near Gore has precisely the same attitude to her great credit.

As for financial resources, I am not able like some others to take an annual foreign foray. It has taken me 9 years to save enough for my upcoming 3 weeks in the Czech Republic and Scotland.

[Gerry Webster]

Marcus & Lesley -

In Marcus' words read the thread. I have made no suggestion  of an "attack" on the UK Fritillary Group  nor that goings-on in the Antipodes are any concern of this Group.

[Hillview croconut]

  I am having a lot of trouble working out what you are on about Gerry.

There is a discussion taking place (or there was) about the illogical process that is in place in NZ regarding import restrictions on new fritillaria species. Your comments which were not about this at all but about the origins and the membership of the UK Group.

This is very important issue for antipodeans - maybe not for those whose boundaries extend only as far as Europe and who don't really have to contend with any quarantine issues.

Cheers, Marcus

[Ian Y]

I think this has been an interesting discussion that raises a number of valid points and obviously some opposing views.

I think it is time and would appreciate if this thread could now move on.

[Gerry Webster]

I am having a lot of trouble working out what you are on about Gerry.

Cheers, Marcus

My apologies Marcus.  I hadn't realised that the Fritillaria thread was for the exclusive use of those in the southern hemisphere to raise  their local concerns.

[Hillview croconut]

Time and place for everyone Gerry. It is an international forum afterall.

Cheers, Marcus

[ronm]

Can anyone advise the range / distribution of F. maximowiczii and F. dagana please? I've got as far as Siberia (  ), and have now stalled. Thanks in advance.

[David Nicholson]

Going collecting Ron?

[ronm]

After a fashion, 

[David Nicholson]

 

[ronm]

F. dagana - Siberia ? Lake Baikal?
F.maximowiczii  - East Siberia and N.E. China?

Care to come along David? 

[David Nicholson]

Nice offer Ron but I think anyone going to Siberia should be sent!