orchid seed on cardboard

[lily-anne]

First and foremost, I only speak from my own experience and give no guarantee for the result - many other compositions and methods might also be possible. Your experience ( positive or negative) can  also help me . Other forum members are already sowing on cardbord and therefore have more experience   (  I like to  hear their experiences ,  especially in the further propagation of the seedlings )
I sow not only on cardboard, because I have found that there is still a chance that something goes wrong and the wrong fungi  destrois the sowings
Cardboard remains an important ingrediënt of the seed medium , because
 the necessary good fungi grows  well on it .
 I use quite a lot of small square plastic pots with a transparent or opal cover
So,   if a problem occurs  in one seed jar  I still have many  pots to go on
Pots with à lid,  for optimal humidity,  to ensure that the fungi and the seedlings never dry out .In the bottem I make a lot of holes , so they can get compost thea from below , and the seeds do not wash away.

Composition of the medium:
A good fine , permeable  soil   (  try yourself different compositions and record everything very carefully , so that later, you still know what you did
and what gave the best results)  Possibly even fine pure leaf mold is also sufficient.
I sift all ingredients through  a fine sieve.
now  I have a composition of :
- 3x filtered compost tea (  to bring no bugs in the medium )
- 1 part perlite
- 1/3 part  very fine akadama (bonsai soil)
- 2 p.fine brown lava ( aquarium)
- 1 p. verry fine bark
- 2 p. verry fine peat
- 1 p vermiculite
-  1 p.  dry fine peat moss -
-  1 + 1/4 p. chopped cardboard scraps (1 to 2 cm)

This year I mixed everything 3 weeks in advance and put it away in a sealed bucket , so  the good mold can begin to grow . In this way, the seeds come in  an optimal medium with plenty off good mold .  Last year  I didn't do it this way, and maybe it is not really necessary, but hopefully it helps more.
 Sowing:
Pots  half filled with the medium,  so  there is still headroom left for the seedlings, as the lid is on it.
Make the ground level and  give it a very light pressure . Scatter the seeds verry  thin and cover it very lightly with fine brown lava (aquarium) or very fine real leaf mold. Then sprinkle some seed on top of it all, so you can follow beter, the evolution of the germination ( with a strong magnifying glass !)
In this years experiment,  I do also a test with some deeper pots, with the same composition, but in the bottom layer  I mixed in a little bit of bonemeal,  hoping that  the  the seedlings will  benefit later . This way de seedlings are not in direct contact with the bonemeal . It might be that this is totally wrong, I 'll see wat comes of it!
I number each pot en weigh them  before I let them suck in, compost tea (5 min) so later on I willl know when to water them.
For the moment the pots are in a dark place, and I'm waiting for the best...
greetings
Lily-Anne




These are the Dactylorhiza seedlings (sown September 2011) . They are still doing very well, but grow very slowly.In the best pot, are at least 50 seedlings
  They are still in the kitchen in a light spot

[lily-anne]

21-8-12
Control of the pots ( after 14 days) whit a good magnifiing glas ( 35x)
 Good signs for the  pots without bonemeal :A  very large part of the visible seedlings get a little swelling in the middel ( as was in previous test )
 The bone meal test looks less positive - here I am not confident and  I will no longer continue to apply in future sowings
Gr.
Lily- Anne

[winwen]

lily-ann,
thanks for your posting!

Even as someone who has already done some sowings (symbiotically and asymbiotically) I find your results very impressive and very encouraging. Really well done!

Maybe the reason for the relatively slow speed of growth lies in the very high density of the seedlings.
But from all my sowings, I can say that the addition of Bonemeal is -for sure- not a good idea. The problem lies in the high ratio of phosphor which sometimes tends to inhibit the growth of mycorrhizal fungi. Moreover the nitrogenium-level is also raised, which can cause inhibition of symbiotic relationships between plants and fungi.

If -at all- a fertilizer is needed, I would tend to use a liquid or soluble organic fertilizer at a very low concentration (0,5ml-1ml per Liter of substrate). Mycorrhizal fungi are very very modest growers and even grow in media with only 5-10% organic matter.

For purposes of repeatability, I do not use compost-tea but rather a mixture of yeast-extract together with some soluble mineral-salts. Inoculation with fungi is done with Perlite-based spawn of the B1 (the most excessively used mycorrhizal fungus for growing orchids) My last try-out-medium was mainly made up of coconut-fiber but I think that this is suboptimal in this case. Next medium to try would be a mixture of decomposed bark/wood-fiber/leafmould together with chipped cardboard and about 30-40% Perlite.

Just one question according the type of cardboard you are using in your medium: is this still CORRUGATED cardboard or some other type. I am asking this because corrugated cardboard also contains a lot of starch-based glue which may also play a major role as a nutrient for the fungi.

[lily-anne]

[quote author=winwen

 Next medium to try would be a mixture of decomposed bark/wood-fiber/leafmould together with chipped cardboard and about 30-40% Perlite


----- good tip to try again later


Just one question according the type of cardboard you are using in your medium: is this still CORRUGATED cardboard or some other type. I am asking this because corrugated cardboard also contains a lot of starch-based glue which may also play a major role as a nutrient for the fungi.
[/quote]

----- Yes it's just simple cardboard  of clean disposable boxes that I use. I try  (If possible  ) to remove a part of the   outer layer
 
Greetings
Lily- Anne

[John Aipassa]

I started my own experiment two months ago with Epipactis mairei seed. This is my experience so far.

My method is the following.

I use small plastic food containers for the medium.

The medium is a mix of:
1. coconut coir
2. seramis
3. super densa, a pond filter medium consisting of 3-5 mm kind of white/yellow lava rock type.

For the card board box strips I use a chewing box for rodents, which you can buy in a pet shop. This card board is softer than regular card board. The rodent box is cut into strips.

The strips are put in a bucket of water mixed with added mycorrhizae spores (a mix of endo and ectomycorrhizae, which you can buy).

The wet strips are put in the food containers, which are then filld up with the medium (between the strips) up until only the top of the card board strips can be seen. I sprayed mycorrhizal water, previously used for wetting the card board, on top of the medium.

I also sprinkled a tiny bit of top soil from a spot in my garden, where a native Epipactis spontaneously appeared.

Then I sprinkled a few dozen seeds of Epipactis mairei on top of it and sprayed it again with the mycorrhizal water.

After putting on the lid I kept the containers on a windowsill in my house.

After 6 weeks the following happened:

Photo 1:
I noticed a tiny green spot with my magnifying glass. The tiny spot can be seen in the middle of the photo. It is hard to see on this picture, but I added it to give you an idea of the size of it all.

Photo 2:
This is the same picture as photo 1, but now the center is magnified.

Photo 3:
The same green spot from a different angle. You can see the mycorrhiza threads. Sorry for the blurriness.

After 8 weeks (today):

Photo 4:
Again a picture where there is hardly anything to see, but in the middle of the photo the green spot is there.

Photo 5:
This is the same photo as photo 4, but now magnified in the center. You can see growth!

Whether it is truly an Epipactis mairei seedling or not is still to be seen, but I have high hopes. I couldn't find other green spots yet, but I will need to wait for that.
 

[Neil]

  Looks promising

[lily-anne]

Hello John,
 I hope it worked, but I wonder how strong your magnifying glass is.
with a very verry strong magnifying glass (as a watchmaker magnifying glass) I'd expect you would see lots of swollen seeds now
Greetings
Lily- Anne

[lily-anne]

These are my Bletilla striata seedlings , sown on 17/02/2011 with cardboard. In the spring of 2012 the seedlings were transplanted for the 2nd time in a container and left outside in a shady area throughout the summer .
To take the picture I took them out of the ground and rinsed them with water, so the roots are more visible .
To protect them, they will be in a frost-free porch this winter
Greetings
Lily- Anne

[lily-anne]

These are the first pictures of the new orchid seed attempt with cardboard.
the first picture are Cypripedium reginae seedlings sown on 16/09/2012
and the second picture are Dactylorhiza sp. sown on 7/08/2012
the other seedlings from the test are too small to capture on a picture, but the results are promising
greetings
Lily-Anne

[John Aipassa]

Great shots Liy-Anne. Did you use the same method for the Cyp. reginae, the Dactylorhiza and the Bletilla as well or do you tweak a bit?

[mark smyth]

Lily-Anne do you have more photos o show what you did with your new attempt with cardboard

[lily-anne]

Great shots Liy-Anne. Did you use the same method for the Cyp. reginae, the Dactylorhiza and the Bletilla as well or do you tweak a bit?

Hello John,
the medium is slightly modified compared to that of the Bletilla
for lime lovers I try different doses of lime
I try to write down exactly how I do it
Greetings
Lily anne

[lily-anne]

Lily-Anne do you have more photos o show what you did with your new attempt with cardboard

Mark,
I have no further photos of the new sowings because they are so small,once they are visible in the pictures I will post them . I will soon post pictures of the evolution of Bletilla from the beginning
Greetings
Lily-Anne

[lily-anne]

Here is a brief overview of my first breeding of Bletilla striata with cardboard
sown on 17/02/2011--
last picture is taken recently on the second repotting
greetings
Lily-Anne

[mark smyth]

Looking great Lily-Anne