Cyclamen 2013

[SJW]

I picked out this plant as my most promising seedling last year and this is the first time it has flowered, I particularly like the black edging to the silver leaves. The seed came from a plant that was originally from Leonidi.

That's a lovely leaf, Melvyn, and the edging really sets it off. I don't have any ex-Leonidi plants (just covet your's and Pat Nicholls's from afar!) so don't know if you get a range of flower colour with them. The flowers on your seedling look to be a good, deepish shade. Are they scented?

[Mark Griffiths]

I tried to take some pictures of Cyclamen leaves in the greenhouse, unfortunately it's so dark that not so many came out. Here are some of the persicum..if you are wondering about the little white dots that's the remains of coolglass I rubbed off a few weeks back.

The punicium came to me from Cyclamen Society seed as Tilebarn Karpathos but I think the leaves of that selection look different.

[cycnich]

A variety of leaf forms from a packet of C. hederifolium 'Tilebarn Graham' seeds, sown Oct 2011. None looks like Tilebarn Graham (and the largest plant is white flowered).  You never quite know what you're going to get from seed exchanges but I'm happy with what's come up. The 'Silver Arrow' plants are much better than the ones I have growing from 'Silver Arrow' seed!

I think you will find tilebarn Graham is a coum. These are more likely to be from tilebarn Helena white flowers with silver arrow leaves but it is only a guess.

[SJW]

I think you will find tilebarn Graham is a coum. These are more likely to be from tilebarn Helena white flowers with silver arrow leaves but it is only a guess.

Whoops, you're absolutely right, Pat. I meant to type 'Tilebarn Greville' but obviously had a brainstorm. They do look like 'Tilebarn Helena', don't they, but I'm not going to stray into the horticultural minefield that is the naming of seedlings from known cultivars!

[cycnich]

Whoops, you're absolutely right, Pat. I meant to type 'Tilebarn Greville' but obviously had a brainstorm. They do look like 'Tilebarn Helena', don't they, but I'm not going to stray into the horticultural minefield that is the naming of seedlings from known cultivars!

Hi Steve
              I am guessing your seed came from an exchange of some sort. Sadly this is where it sometimes goes wrong, it only takes one person to send in wrongly labeled seed and for the next person to repeat that and a clone that has taken so long to raise becomes lost in short space of time. Funny enough I was talking to Peter moore at the show a few weeks ago about the very same plant and he told me it took him 10 years of selection and back crossing to create it. It would be a crime if it were to be lost by bad selection. You have already realised it is not what it is supposed to be but sadly not everyone is that astute and there are some who won't even care and will pass it on anyway. From my own experience tilebarn greville/shirley comes 100% true in leaf,it only remains to select the flower colour to give it the correct name. This I stress is from my own seed from plants that came direct from peter. A prime example of poor selection is bowles Apollo now sadly lost and now available only as a strain which produces some nice plants but not a patch on the original that I remember, I am sure better selection would have saved it but  inferior seedlings and seed from them was passed on and it is now lost.

[SJW]

Hi Pat, I couldn't agree more. I must stress that I'm not being critical of seed exchanges because, frankly, without them I wouldn't have a greenhouse full of nice plants. But, as you say, some donors are more rigorous than others when it comes to seed labelling. Normally, I just send stuff in under the species name with, at most, a note saying "ex. cultivar name" (if I'm happy to call the parent by that cultivar name) or eg "2nd gen CSE"  In this case, the 'Tilebarn Greville' seed came from the CS seed distribution! I also have a very dodgy-looking pot of 'Tilebarn Shirley' - basically just silver-leaved - from the same source...C. mirabile 'Tilebarn Nicholas' is another one that needs careful selection to ensure we stay true to the original - I've seen some poor forms of this in the past. And another is 'Tilebarn Karpathos' that Mark mentioned a few posts back. I'm not sure that everyone is ruthless enough in rogueing out those that don't have flowers the same colour as rhodium vividum. The occasional series that Trevor Wiltshire writes on cyclamen cultivars for the CS journal is useful and, longer-term, when the CS website is overhauled an expanded version of this with a comprehensive photo gallery would be a terrific online resource so that people can check their plants against examples of the original cultivars.

Talking of 'Bowles Apollo', I've only read descriptions of the original plant but I do know that a photo of a painting of it was published in one of the horticultural journals (RHS?AGS?) years ago. If any kind forumist has a copy of this that they could post here that would be great.

[SJW]

Talking of 'Bowles Apollo', I've only read descriptions of the original plant but I do know that a photo of a painting of it was published in one of the horticultural journals (RHS?AGS?) years ago. If any kind forumist has a copy of this that they could post here that would be great.

Apparently, the reproduction of the painting is in the Bulletin of the Alpine Garden Society, vol.46 no. 3 ( September 1978 ) p. 236: it is the leaf in the upper row on the far right. There is also a discussion by F W Buglass on pp 240-1 about the origin of this plant. So if anyone has a back copy...

[krisderaeymaeker]

I tried to take some pictures of Cyclamen leaves in the greenhouse, unfortunately it's so dark that not so many came out. Here are some of the persicum..if you are wondering about the little white dots that's the remains of coolglass I rubbed off a few weeks back.
The punicium came to me from Cyclamen Society seed as Tilebarn Karpathos but I think the leaves of that selection look different.

Great leafforms Mark . The pewter persicum is fantastic .We did see forms like this in the wild in Cyprus .

[Mark Griffiths]

thanks Kris. I'd love to see it in the wild myself, preferably in flower, maybe one day.

On the subject of the "cultivars" it's a bit of a minefield. I tend to avoid asking for seed because I generally know they will be out in some way and I have no reference to go for. I'd prefer that we talk about strains and apply rigour to that. I think "cultivar" does have the inference in some ways that you can clone it which unless you can take a knife to it, you can't (?)

[Maggi Young]

Apparently, the reproduction of the painting is in the Bulletin of the Alpine Garden Society, vol.46 no. 3 ( September 1978 ) p. 236: it is the leaf in the upper row on the far right. There is also a discussion by F W Buglass on pp 240-1 about the origin of this plant. So if anyone has a back copy...

In the spirit of fair dealing, for non-commercial research and study, here are some photos of the picture and text referred to :








Picture of Painting by Gerard Parker  Text by F.W. Bulglass - from AGS Bulletin 46/3 1978

[Roma]

Thanks for that, Maggi.  I think I should have that bulletin up in the loft, covered in bat droppings   My old SRGC journals are there too.  Maybe I'll get round to rescuing them some day

[Mark Griffiths]

thanks for that, the "Apollo" I grew from seed are nothing like that and I suspected that these were apples that had fallen a very long way from the tree as they were so ordinary.  Very impressive in it's true form I must say.

[SJW]

In the spirit of fair dealing, for non-commercial research and study, here are some photos of the picture and text referred to

Maggi, many thanks for finding this so quickly and posting. I've wanted to see details of the leaf of the original plant for years. As Mark says, there's some pale imposters around these days. I suspect that all 8 leaf forms shown would now be classed as Bowles Apollo group?

[partisangardener]

A friend gave me this trunk pieces which just look like this reproduction in the book
The first one with a fresh wound
shown in detail in the next picture
The second one with an old wound
and detail

[partisangardener]

Then one with a thickening in the middle of the trunk.
Seems that C.purpurascens propagates  sometimes this way in nature.